Rivera, Girardi and rain
Obviously the big story of the day is, what's wrong with Mariano Rivera. He flew back to New York yesterday to get an MRI done on his right shoulder and to get the shoulder examined. The NY Times and Post each reported that he might need minor arthroscopic surgery. Brian Cashman didn't rule that out to me, but basically said he wouldn't have any real guesstimate until the MRI results come back today.
The other underlying issue on this situation is Joe Girardi and his handling of it. He described Rivera as having a "cranky body" before yesterday's game, and did not identify any specific problem, even when asked. Cashman, however, identified Rivera's shoulder as a problem. After the game, Girardi continued to say he did not know any specifics. The session grew contentious, as some people basically flat-out indicated they thought he was lying, and he grew defensive.
I readily admit that Girardi has not been the most forthcoming on injury situations this season. As a fan, you're free to think that's a problem or it's not. That has led some to believe he simply is dishonest. I think it's a little less straightforward than that. I think Girardi absolutely does not want to talk about injuries, and his relentless optimism leads him to act things are better than they sometimes might be. But as nice as it might be to have him share every little detail, I'm realistic too and don't expect that. I think people were spoiled by how Joe Torre handled things, but he also had decades of managerial experience to get to that point.
Could Girardi be a little more up-front? Sure. But I don't expect him to give us a play-by-play of the medicals.
In other news, the weather is horrible here in Boston. There's a good chance they won't be playing baseball at Fenway Park tonight.
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Comments (17)
why in the name of Zeus would Rivera pitch again this year?
It seems unanimous among the NYC beat writers that
1. Girardi told them in the pre-game press conference that Mo was going to NYC to have his routine end-of-season checkup,
2. then when they subsequently talked with Cashman he said that in fact Mo had a problem in his shoulder and was going to NYC for an MRI, and finally
3. at the post-game press conference the writers asked Girardi about the discrepancy and he got so angry that he banged his fist on the table.
The indignation of the writers did not seem to be about Girardi not telling them everything, but about his making up the story that Mo was leaving the team in the middle of a road trip to have a routine end-of-season checkup (players have them every year, but not until the season is over). I expect they would have been satisfied with an uninformative answer like Torre often gave, such as, 'I can't really give you anything about that right now but as soon as I have information I'll let you know.' It was the flat-out misinformation that seemed to get them steamed. (And perhaps the notion that they were being treated like a group of sixth-graders who wouldn't know the routine about end-of-season check-ups?)
Girardi v. NYC media is not a huge story in itself, but there's not much to write about right now. It would be a tiny sidelight if the team was in their usual September pennant-race mode.
He probably won't.
You can listen to pre and post game interviews with girardi on the Lohud Blog.
After listening to him I sense two things.....1) He is clearly defending his player and 2) He really doesn't know how serious Mo's "Crankyness" is so he doesn't want to send any alarms off to the media so they get in a frenzy.
But the problem with all that is he has Cashman giving a way a lot more information to the media than he is, when clearly Cashman and Girardi know about the same amount. Him and Cash need to get on the same page when they talk to the media or they can be portrayed as not telling all the truth.
He probably won't.
You can listen to pre and post game interviews with girardi on the Lohud Blog.
After listening to him I sense two things.....1) He is clearly defending his player and 2) He really doesn't know how serious Mo's "Crankyness" is so he doesn't want to send any alarms off to the media so they get in a frenzy.
But the problem with all that is he has Cashman giving a way a lot more information to the media than he is, when clearly Cashman and Girardi know about the same amount. Him and Cash need to get on the same page when they talk to the media or they can be portrayed as not telling all the truth.
It sounds like (from what I just heard on WFAN) that Cashman may have thrown Girardi under the bus a little. Cash apologized to the press for the way Girardi misled them on Rivera - that's pretty damning in terms of languague.
Misled infers intentional deception on the part of Girardi. On the other hand, the way Girardi reacted after the game makes it sound like he had no idea what was going on. Was there a miscommunication between Rivera, Cashman and Girardi? I would like to think that was the case more than anyone trying to specifically lie about the issue.
In the end, as long as Rivera shows up in 09 health and sound I really don't care if Joe and the press corps get along.
Chip, you were right on target on the last page. Kat's next post said basically the same thing--that Joe G has rubbed some of the NY press the wrong way, but that maybe they've gotten a bit too used to Torre's impeccable treatment.
Still, I don't agree with your last sentiment above. I do care if the press and Girardi get along. An unhealthy relationship with the press can cause a manager unnecessary pressure and grief, and help to turn a clubhouse sour overnight.
Of course, the real story here is making sure Mo is healthy for '09, but this is worth keeping an eye on. Not saying things are anywhere near this bad, or even headed this way, but when it lets loose, the monster that is the the NY sports media can run a guy out of town in a hurry. And Bob Lemons aren't that easy to find.
My impression of the situation is poor communication. Isn't communication the worst practice skill amongst our leaders. Rivera could have said one thing to Girardi and another but basicly the same to Cahman but the brain recorded something different in their minds. Plus, why does Girardi have to make the reporters jobs so easy with readily available information that may not pan out. He could have said it differently but chose the wrong words. Get off his back, he's to accessibile to the media in the first place. The guys can't even taken a shower without a mike in their face after a game which may have hinged on their ability or inability to make the play. A little space and consideration may enhanced reporting by the reporters. Like the old days the players were given more respect and gave respect and stories to their favorites. On another note maybe Joba belongs in the bullpen and the Yanks should pursue at least two front line starters.
DC -
I don't know if that's entirely true. Tom Coughlin of the Giants had an awful relationship with the press (some members openly campaigned for the Giants to fire him) and then when the Giants won last year it all went away. I think the same is true here. Guys like Bellichick, Parcells, LaRussa - have all at one time or another had contentious relationships with the press, but they get away with it because they're winners.
Now even if Girardi knew Mo was hurt, I don't have a problem with him not sharing that with the press. I more have a problem Cashman throwing Girardi under the bus as he did.
Everything Cashman has done lately, calling out Girardi, letting it leak to the press that he put in a congratulatory call to Torre (a very obvious jab at Hank), his unwillingness to talk about his future - these are all things that indicate to me that he isn't sure he wants to come back here.
Here's what a lot of Yankee fans seem to overlook.
The Rays already have great pitching and are on the verge of becoming a rotation juggernaut with David Price getting a full time crack at the rotation early next season and Wade Davis (who might be the top right-handed pitching prospect in MLB) likely to get a shot next season as well.
It is absolutely essential that the Yanks counter with a very strong rotation of their own - and signing Sabathia (if he wants to come here) and keeping Joba in the rotation are the keys to making that happen.
Make no mistake, the Rays are going to have an unbelievable rotation within the next couple of years barring a plague of injuries. It is a MUST that the Yanks counter with a formidable one of their own - especially with Boston and Toronto also likely to have very good rotations.
Besides, we fans shouldn't overlook the likes of Mark Melancon probably securing a prominent role in that pen next season (a role he's been groomed for since his college days as a closer) with an assist from Humberto Sanchez if he stays healthy.
Joba needs to be in the rotation regardless. They cannot rely on the FA market alone to address their rotation needs.
Viper -
I have all the respect in the world for what the Rays did this year, but I'm not overly concerned with them as a long term threat. They don't have the revenue stream to lock up guys like Kazmir, Garza, or Upton. I can't imagine that their pen is going to be NEARLY as effective next year as it was this year and, after seeing what happened this year with Hughes, Kennedy, Bucholtz, Masterson, Gallardo, King Felix, and a host of other young pitchers, I don't think that you can count on consistent successes from such a young rotation.
That said, I agree that the Yankees need to firm up the rotation. How they do that is anyone's guess. I still don't think Sabathia will end up here. I'm not going to get into the Burnett debate with you for the 200th time. So that leaves guys like Sheets, Lowe, Garland, Ollie Perez in addition to Pettitte and Moose (Moose btw on WFAN strongly indicated that this would be his last season because coming back would commit him to trying to get 300 and that would take at least 3 years). I'm with you that Joba should be in the rotation but bottom line for me is rotation or pen, make a decision and leave him there. I think a lot of the decision on Joba will boil down to whether or not Cash is here next year.
Girardi not telling the press everything doesn't bother me one bit...he and Cash not being on the same page is what bothers me ;-)
Too bad this is a news maker instead of the perenial playoff push...
Realist - I'm not even bothered by him and Cashman not being on the same page. I'm bothered by the way Cashman made it known that he and Joe weren't on the same page. Brian publically calling out his manager is bush league. It's the sort of thing I would expect from JP Riccardi or Billy Beane not Cash.
Chip,
I did say that the Rays' rotation is going to be a force over the next couple of years. Not suggesting they will be a juggernaut in 2009.
Nonetheless, it is still a must that the Yanks counter with a stacked rotation of their own simply because of the competition in their division.
Right now, there are three rotations in the AL East alone that is better - TB, BOS, and TOR. That needs to change.
On the Sabathia front, it is entirely possible that he ends up not signing with the Yanks.
But I still don't believe he'll end up on the West Coast, especially the Dodgers, because they won't fork over that kind of cheddar.
So it will basically be up to Sabathia to take some contract in the $100M range away from NY - or take a proposal from the Yanks closer to the $130M - $140M range.
It's not often that athletes opt to leave that much cheddar on the table on the biggest payday of their lives, but I guess anything is possible.
He could buy a half dozen dream houses with that extra $30-40M, so we'll see.
I'll say this much about your Giambi proposition this morning and the possibility of bringing back Abreu next season.
If that's part of Cashman's plan (which I don't think is going to happen), I'll be on a plane to NY to find him and punch him dead in the face and demand that he leaves town for good.
That would be the dumbest thing they could do to fix this team.
Viper - I agree with Olney on Abreu. The Yankees will offer him arbitration and that's it. If he gets a better offer he'll take it and the Yankees will get a pick. If he doesn't get a better offer the Yankees will have him back on a 1 year deal - which wouldn't be so bad.
Chip,
You are correct and that does anger me more...I hadn't fully read everything before my last comment and you are correct, it seems as if he was throwing Joe under the bus. Not good!
I have much bigger concerns about Girardi than his novice clumsiness with the media.
When he has learned a great deal more about who should play and when, and the order in which they should bat (on a level of sophistication above leftyrightyleftyrighty), and when to bunt and when not, and when and how to use the hit-and-run, and how long to wait to sit regulars for bad play or lack of hustle, and most especially how to gather up a bunch of giant egos into one big joint effort -- that will be plenty of time to focus on his callowness in terms of making media contact work for the team.
I was in favor of hiring Girardi as Torre's replacement and I still think he's smart, hardworking, and ambitious. The question that is still unanswered in my mind is whether he can be flexible enough to recognize and learn from his mistakes.
If the answer is yes, then we should see recognizable changes next season in the areas I mentioned above.
I thought Girardi "learned how to deal with people" and what not from his stint in Florida - according to his own words.
For all the Girardi apologists that want to blame the media and media hype, Girardi prolly owes the media for overhyping the job he did in Florida, as Freddi Gonzalez is doing the same thing with that Marlins team this year, after pitchers like Olsen and company have had a year to recover from the abuse Girardi subjected their arms to.