On the Yankees beat

Girardi is playing with a team that he chose in ST but 2/9 of the offensive is on the DL. 1/9 Damon is AWOL. 2/9 are struggling to be mediocre Cano and Giambi. 1/9 is inconsistent at best Abreu. 1/9 gives it all he has Melky. 2/9 represent what Girardi saw in camp that is actually performing to expectations Jeter and Matsui.

So how much offense can you expect from this team.

Pitching SP not that bad of late but not good enough. Relief pitching actually not that bad if we could forget Farnsworth pitches for us.

I'm expecting Girardi will son abandon some of his experiments/trust and start playing guys according to who actually has a shot at helping the club.

I would definetly ditch Ensberg and play Gonzales. Damon,Giambi and Farnsworth would be better in another uniform. I bring up Gardner to play CF. Not that knowlegeable about our minors but these changes maybe a month away if things continue and I believe that unfortunately is the way the season is going to pan out. Hopefully, we can learn from the remainder of the season with a different roster which may be represent our 2009 squad.

The Indians have had very solid performance from their starting pitchers this year, but their record doesn't reflect it because their bullpen has been relatively woeful (even with Borowski on the DL with some "made up" injury). Since Jake Westbrook will return soon giving them 6 starters (Sabathia, Carmona, Lee, Byrd, Laffey are the others), it seems increasingly likely in my eyes that the Indians will at least test the waters on trading Sabathia to see if they can get bullpen help and a young starter prospect that could eventually replace Paul Byrd in the rotation. If I'm right in that view, the Yanks certainly have plenty of bullpen arms that could be used in a trade, but what starter would it take to make a potential trade and what are the Yanks willing to give up in that situation? Maybe I'm reading it wrong completely, but who knows.

Has anyone seen Garret Anderson in the field this year? Is he playing adequately? If I recall correctly, he's a FA this year and I'd be surprised if the Angels resigned him. He's a possible "stopgap" player.

Really just a lot of speculation on my part. No real research went into this.

Freddy Garcia is well known as a FA and a possibility. On June 1, Kris Benson can opt out of his contract with the Phillies if not promoted (he won't be as he has not recovered in time) and Weaver could opt out of his contract on June 15 if not promoted.

HYD: I'm not saying thet you are interpeting their potential situation wrong but lefty pitching is primo in the big leagues. CC contract with the Indians would be more than likely provide home team discount. Indians have the fan base to withstand the salary increase.

But I 'd give them Farnsworth and Kennedy in a heartbeatplus Throw in Igawa. I don't mean to make light of your thoughts or proposal but there is more wrong with this Yankee club. Age of its positional players is one, plus underachieving.

If you think Sabathia is coming to the Yanks in a mid-season deal, that's crazy.

Even if it were to happen, it would require a helluva lot more than Kennedy and Farnsworth to do it.

Start with Joba and the Indians may start listening.

I like Kennedy and I'm confident he will turn it around. But you can't trade a bag of sh!t for a bad of gold. The Indians' GM is a lot smarter than that.

I made the mistake to write this team off last season at this time so I'm not going to do it this season.

There's still plenty of time to right the ship. Only one more game without A-Rod and Posada is likely to start a rehab assignment in another week or so.

Also, the real team to watch is Boston and they aren't playing great ball either. TB is winnign the sprint through 40+ games, but they do not have enough to sustain it for a whole season.

Viper: I let them have everything that I would want to rid the team of except Kennedy. So I'm half -hearted with the proposal. I would definetly explore trades of Damon, Abreu, Giambi, Matsui and Farnsworth. Obviously, they all can't go but some interest maybe generated from the grouping. I believe the team is lost in a downward spiral of non championship calibre SP and aging bat speed. We can't get rid of them all. But I have no fondness for any of them except Matsui. I believe he's quite valuable but has aging bat speed.

Larry,

When the team decided to sign these guys, they have little choice but to accept the consequences of such moves and ride it out.

This is why spending like a drunken sailor is great for the short term and quick fix. But then the sailor sobers up and awakes the next morning lying next to an amazon and realizing he married her the night before. He then spends the next several years trying to get out of said marriage.

Okay, that's a bit of a goofy analogy, but the overall point is that they have to live with the consequences of bad decisions.

Giambi, Farnsworth, and Abreu (if they decide against resigning him) will be gone after the 2008 season. Matsui and Damon are both signed through 2009.

Nobody is going to trade for these guys. Matsui has the most trade value but he can veto any deal he wants.

Plus, Cashman isn't going to give up on the season when it's only May and the Red Sox are not playing like they did last season. They have plenty of their own issues.

Don't expect to see any of these names gone until the season is over.

The team needs to get younger as I've been saying for a long, long, time. But that can't happen overnight. The team can’t get younger if they don’t have young kids that are ready to take over. Tabata and Jackson probably won’t be ready until at least 2010.

I know it's tough for Yankee fans but we need to be patient. Things will turn around.

You can't evaluate the entire team for this season with A-Rod and Posada both on the DL.

I’m just glad Hal has equal power to Hank. He’s the sensible one and not as likely to panic or say something stupid to the media.

In regard to the Mets game, Pettitte had good stuff at times (with 7 K's) but that one bad inning did him in.

But we did not lose any ground to Tampa Bay thanks to Ryan Ludwick, (the player I wanted to trade for) who hit a game winning HR for St. Louis! He's hitting around .330. Real baseball fans who know the game and actually played the game can see his talent.

Did anyone see Ankiel jumping over the wall to save a HR with a great catch? You can see it all on Yahoo! Sports and another article on him in The Sporting News. 6 HR's and 22 RBI's so far, laser arm and great defense in CF. You think we could trade Melky for Ankiel one for one?

The Cardinals have a great team this year, right out of the blue.

Kind of sad what has happened to the Yankees this year.

Shaun Powell wrote a column which looked like it was quoting me verbatim ...

"This isn't a championship team ... this is a team ready to say goodbye next winter to a handful of old, decaying, high-priced hitters whose contracts mercifully are almost up."

Other than Wang, eject the Tower of Babel. Find a core like Colorado. Find All-American talent that can culturally and linguistically stay on the same page -- that's how you develop esprit de corps.

Sort through Horne, Melancon, Sanchez and the others. Draft LHP's. Fire Cashman and Jean Afterman.

The following plays all must go ...

Giambi
Farnsworth
Hawkins
Damon
Abreu (not for 16 mil and fear of the wall)

Keep Matsui for Japan/Yen marketing.

We need to really analyze the 450 million spent on Mo, A-Rod and Jorge and see if that money couldn't have been better spent on players like Eckstein, Ludwick, Ankiel, Lilly, Gregg, Sowers, Josh Hamilton and others of that caliber. I know we could easily have traded for Josh Hamilton. We dealt with Gooden, Howe and Strawberry through their problems ... why not the player with the bat arm and bat speed in the entire league?

Cano is doing better of late but overall he's around .210. I wonder what is wrong with him. Too much money too young?

We need a team like Tampa Bay. Young, tough and hungry.

I saw this year coming all through the Fall. Cashman's moves and non-moves sealed our fate. But again, in reality, who knew Posada would be hurt or that Hughes would have a cracked rib and Kennedy would be smacked around like this? Who thought Cano would hit .200 or that Molina would not hit like last year?

Yet with Igawa, Pavano, Giambi, Farnsworth, Hawkins ... way too much dead wood. When Igawa gave up a Grand Slam to that Tampa teenager, well that was the last straw re: Cashman.

After Clemens, McNamee and Leyritz and C-Rod, we need to restore the pride and aura of the team. It's like the lights are out but nobody knows it's dark ...

Yahoo Sports ran this article today ... and cites the NY Daily News ...

Article begins ...

Giambi wears golden thong and shares it with teammates

The key to turning the New York Yankees season around could be under Jason Giambi's pinstriped pants. The Yankee slugger revealed Friday he slips on a gold lamé thong with a flame-line waistband when he's trying to get out of a hitting slump — and he's shared it with his teammates.

"It works every time," Giambi told the Daily News after his secret was outed on Portfolio.com.

Derek Jeter agreed that Giambi's thong works, although "it's so uncomfortable running around the bases." "I had it over my shorts and stuff," he said. "I was 0-for-32 and I hit a homer on the first pitch. That's the only time I've ever worn it."

Johnny Damon also admitted donning the golden panties "probably three times." "I may need to wear it again soon," said Damon, who is batting a mediocre .255.

What is the secret of Giambi's golden thong?

"You're not worrying about your hands or your balance at the plate," Damon said. "You're worried about the uncomfortable feeling you're receiving."

Source: New York Daily News

They never stop, do they? Why must this once proud and even great team continue to have such on and off the field disgraces in a perpetual manner?

The Red Sox have pink bats, pink ribbons ... while women soldiers in the stands in uniform sit their with their limbs blown off ...

Sick as that may be ... the sharing of the thong trumps even that in the disgusting category ...

These are our role models?

Ant is retarded.

Yeah let's be more like the Rays. Too bad it took 10 years of being the worst team in baseball and never exceeding the 70-win mark until last season to be in this position.

I'll take 13 playoff appearances, 4 rings, and 6 pennants during the same stretch thank you very much.

Ant should find another hobby.

Kat: Ant's racism is getting more and more disturbing. Is there anything that could be done about this?

We have not heard any valid reason to not start Joba! Now Girardi say's it could be another year or two. Our Starting Rotation is in desperate need of a spark-plug to ignite this old car! And with Joba's talent and enthusiasm, he could very well be the spark to get us out of this slump. As Pettitte is struggling, and Mussina could at any start crumble like last year, and Wang can not win , when his team only provides him 2 runs a game.
So! if it means giving Joba a chance as a starter, what do we have to lose? He can always go back in the pen, and pitch one waisted inning.
Also it is not fair to Duncan, to play him in such a limited role. Like a game once in a while, and pitch hitting. How can he ever develope to the slugger and fan motivator during that short stint last season, before Torre pulled the plug on him, to replace him with Juicy Giambi.
He excites the crowd, he loves to play, and he could be the other spark that will ignite the over-priced-under achievers, as we have.
Last year he hit what 6-8 Hr's in such a few at bats! yet he was benched.
We have two diamonds to spark the team, one as a starter, and one as an every day player to build confidence, and get in the grove.
Yet! The secret is don't play Joba, and Duncan will never get the chance.
Girardi! you need to take risks, and stop letting Cash-less tell you how to run the team, he feels Joba is fine where he is now.
What happened to that Manager for the Marlins, who was tough with his players, and the owner? He is now to content, and is patroizing the players that do bad, by making excuses for them, when they play less then there capabilities.
I say! Let Hank dictate who will start, he will have Joba in the next series, if we keep stinking up the field in LAST PLACE.
Girardi is waiting for that circle to fit into a square, without taking chances. If we continue to lose! He better not quit his day job as an announcer on ESPN. And if we don't fire Cash-less soon he will continue to be complacent, and have us sink into deep despair.

Garret Anderson will retire as an Angel.

Everyone seems to assume Freddy Garcia is worth pursuing.Like he's going to rescue the backend of the rotation.I doubt it.
If he is 100% healthy don't you think other teams will want his services? It's not automatic.

I have not heard 1 report he was throwing well or when exactly he's going to be ready.Let alone can he pitch 7 innings ?

IMHO NY will continue to look to Scranton for pitching.

I agree trade relief which NY is currently strong in for a RH bat w/some pop.Corey Hart comes to mind.Brewers are without lefty hitters and need bullpen help.

I believe Ian Kennedy will emerge as a good middle of the rotation starter.Even if he goes 8-12 this yr.

There is little NY can fix in the middle of the season ,to a large part this is due to inflated contracts.

Realistically if NY tanks it the only players they might unload are Damon and Abreu ,Farnsworth and Hawkins.A contending AL team might pick up the remainder of Giambi's contract come the trading deadline August 1st.MIGHT.

The season is still young my friends alot of twists and turns yet to come.It's 162 game season.

I see yesterday's loss to the Mets more of a failure of Pettitte than with the hitting or Farnsworth.Pettitte is the #2 starter he has yet to step up ,if he'd pitched 7 innings and gave up 1 run then we'd be talking about how great a pitcher Andy is ,instead it's the failure of the offense to score more than 4 runs off the best pitcher in baseball.C'mon

I think Meacham is just about the worst 3B coach I have ever seen.

Girardi looks a year older each week that he manages in his first season at the Yankees helm. Torre, meanwhile, looks a year younger each week that he manages the Dodgers. If this keeps up how soon will the two look like contemporaries?

I see the brainless Ant bashers are out again. Wahhhhh! please administrator......stop Ant's words from getting into my empty little head.....wahhhh they hurt because I either cant understand them or don't like them. I need to think of some names to call Ant because I am so mentally superior and much more high thinking than him and I prove it by going to the higher level of labeling him or calling him a moron or racist or idiot but I need a new name today since I have repeated the same thought 100 times this week.

Delancy,

I actually sympathize with your pain over Anthony. He's in deep trouble mentally and for that reason it is hard to see him abused. You may not realize that you're seeing the culmination of a long process. But I've been here a long time and I've seen every approach to Anthony from rational argument to sarcasm to saintly tolerance (you know who you are) to frustrated lashing out. I've struggled myself about how to respond, especially to the more loathsomely biased remarks he posts, and in the end I've come to accept that for me silence is almost always best. But in my observation Anthony seeks attention at any price, and whatever will be surest get a response, no matter how negative that response, is what he'll send. To that degree people are justified in feeling that he is asking for it, and to that degree it is hard to fault them for giving him what he so much wants.

It isn't that Ant is racist, he's just foolish.

Hamilton was traded for Edision Volquez who is right now one of the better young pitchers in the NL - Yankees did not want to part with young pitching for Johan so there's no way they were going to do it for Hamilton.

As for getting Ankiel and Ludwick - first of all why would St. Louis trade them? Especially Ankiel whom the organization has invested a ton of resources into to turn from a star pitching prospect to a pretty good outfielder.

Why would the Indians have traded Jeremy Sowers? They are likely to lose Sabathia after this year and so trading away pitching prospects doesn't make sense.

As bad as he is, Ted Lilly is Chicago's second best pitcher - why would they trade him?

Eckstien turned down a chance to be a reserve for the Mets so he could start for Toronto (he's hurt now btw) why would he accept a deal to be a back up for the Yankees?

It's easy to say "we should have gotten this guy or that guy" but the player has to want to come here - the team he's on has to want to trade him here.

As for the money spent on Jorge and Alex - You're getting a glimpse into what life without either of those two players would have been like had the Yankees not brought them back - how's that working out for NY?

Some of the guys that you mention (Giambi, Farnsworth, Hawkins) will be gone at the end of the year - probably Abreu too - but you can't just wave a wand and make the contracts for signed players disappear in a puff of smoke. So Damon will likely be here until his contract is up.

Your comment about Matsui was out of line.

HYD - I think more likely than Garrett Anderson, the Angels' OF that the Yankees will look at this winter is Juan Rivera. He shouldn't cost a ton of money, he's younger, better with the glove, and is a right handed bat with some pop - all things that the Yankees will look at.

Going into FA next year I'm going to assume that the Yankees can't/won't get Sabathia and Tex. I'm also going to assume, for the moment, that none of the Yankees' FA return. That said, here is one way I could see the main roster shaping up:

Damon - LF
Jeter - SS
Tex - 1b
Alex - 3b
Posada - C
Matsui - DH
Rivera - RF
Cano - 2b
Melky - CF

Wang, Hughes, Joba, Wolf, Kennedy (though I could EASILY see the Yankees moving Kennedy in the right deal and leaving Joba in the pen based on Girardi/Cashman's comments from yesterday)

Chip

Dempster has emerged as the Cubbies 2nd best starter.
In fairness to Lilly he's now 4-4 after an atrocious start and has dropped his ERA from a high of 9.95 nearly a month ago to 5.33 today.His last 5 starts or so have been very good.

Rivera will never be a starting RF for NY.

To me Tex would be a high priority for the coming season.

Randy Wolf?? I don't think so.

I see these potential off season signings by NY:

Tex
Brian Fuentes(lefty setup)
Baldelli(if he can prove he's healthy)

here's a big IF -the Angels don't pick up the club option on Vladdy

rumours circulating that if the Rockies throw in the towel Matt Holiday might be gotten in a trade probably around the trading deadline .His contract runs thru the 09 season at 13 mil.

Rocco Baldelli will never prove to be healthy. That's always been his problem. I don't recall him ever playing a full season.

He's the Carl Pavano of outfielders - without the bad attitude to go with it.

And Matt Holliday would be outrageously expensive in a trade. They would have to give up a ton for him and they don't have any room for him unless Melky is included in the deal.

Abreu won't be gone until the season is over and Matsui and Damon are going to be Yankees - like it or not - until 2009 is over.

This is going to be a completely different outfield in two years. Hopefully, with a lot of youth and speed.

Tabata and Jackson won't be ready to contribute until at least 2010.

Holliday is somewhat of a cult hero with the Rockies... he's going nowhwere.

DOC

If I were a GM and the Rockies wanted to part with Holliday for Melky and prospects I'd make that deal in a NY minute.

I'd also give some consideration to seeing if Jeff Francis is available.

To acquire Holiday would be along the same lines as Atlanta trading for Tex last yr.Salty and Harrison and a couple of throw ins

Quite frankly I haven't been all that impressed w/ either Jackson or Tabata.
Jackson had a great 2nd half last season .This season he's got about 6 RBI 0 homers.Same can be said for Tabata.I see Tabata as a kind of Jose Guillen type without the power.Let's hope he's emotionally mature enough to handle the pressure it takes to play for NY if and when he makes it.

I would stay away from Holliday - I know he had an MVP season last year, but he strikes me as a guy who is going to need to move to DH within two years - think Jason Giambi.

Tabata is 19-years old. Second youngest player at the AA level (Mets Fernando Martinez is the youngest) so I'm not going to get on him too much for not having his emotions in check. Austin Jackson is also quite young, and quite raw. He's also been playing non-stop since the start of last season (he participated in Hawaiian Winter Ball) so it's entirely possible he's a little worn down.

Either way I'm certainly not making any major judgement calls about them at this point. Though in the right deal I would move Tabata simply because as he's gotten bigger he's lost some speed and hasn't brought much power.

I'm not sure I see much of a difference between Juan Rivera and Rocco Baldelli except for the fact that Rivera has missed time with a broken leg whereas Baldelli has a muscular issue that may well end his career. In fact, Rivera has more pop, a better average and has been healthier than Baldelli over the course of their two careers.

CHIP

Just for the sake of debate .Baldelli was a tremendous talent before these health issues curtailed his playing time and I agree perhaps his career.Baldelli never had a chance to start peaking as a ballplayer because of the aforementioned health problems.
if you take that into consideration he's far and away the better player.Tremendous defensive player as well.

Rivera who I like has never been much more than a role player.06 was the only yr he received any consistent playing time due to outfield injuries .He did play well .He's also just a so-so defensive outfielder.

My point to begin with is if Baldelli is healthy a team would be foolish not to take a look perhaps w/ an incentive laden contract.No harm in that is there?

one other point Rivera has had his share of injuries as well spending nearly the entire 07 season on the DL and 2 other stints on the DL in 6 seasons

The power numbers will develop with Tabata and Jackson. They are so young, as Chip said, that we can't make any judgement on their prospective major league careers.

For those of you who love Melky, keep in mind that he's not exactly known for his power either and it's just now starting to develop under A-Rod's workout regimen.

Tabata is only 19. Jackson is only 21. Melky is two months away from 24.

I don't have a problem taking a flier on Baldelli as long as they don't have any expectations for him. He is a talented player - when he plays.

That said, I don't see it happening because the Yanks have no room for him anyways.

Ruse -

I like the odds of a player recovering from a broken leg/broken kneecap better than the odds of Baldelli recovering from some strange muscular issue that has no known cure.

Ruse - In general I agree with you that Baldelli would be a tremendous guy to sign - if he were healthy. However here's the most recent report on him:

OF Rocco Baldelli, out since spring training with a muscle fatigue disorder, has resumed workouts. Baldelli continues to seek medical answers and said he still hopes to resume his playing career. "I'm hoping that some of these medications I'm taking are going to help me get on the field for an extended period of time without having the problems that I had," he said.

"Basically along the lines my body isn't making or producing ATP the right way, and therefore not allowing my muscles to work as they should and recover like they're supposed to on a day-to-day basis," he said.

Baldelli allowed that his condition is "difficult to explain."

"I go out there and my body is literally spent after a short amount of time on the field, which makes it extremely frustrating and difficult, but it's something that's kind of a reality right now, and we're dealing with the best we can," Baldelli said. "As far as my baseball career, I'm not here to tell you I'm retiring. We're still going to pursue any avenue that we can to try and figure out what is going on and have a better understanding of what is going on."

Look, perfect world I sign both of them.

Scratch that. I didn't realize Baldelli's condition was that severe.

You have to pass on him.

neither did I

You guys can stick to your guns about Tabata and Jackson but I feel otherwise.I think the 2 of them are way over hyped.Jackson 6 RBI Tabata .221 both at Trenton which is just a slight step away from TripleA and showing very little.Neither will make an impact on NY in 2010.Tabata i suspect will be unloaded in a trade.I'm very prepared to eat crow.

Gardner and Curtis are having much better seasons and have both played consistently better baseball throughout their young MILB careers.Curtis could prove to be a good 4th outfielder .

Ruse - I'm not going to tell anyone what their opinions of Yankee prospects should be - however:

Austin Jackson's numbers at AA:
.277 AVG, .365 OBP, 44 hits, 11 2b, 3 3b, 1 HR, 11 RBI, 6 SB, 22 BB, 31 K, 25 runs scored.

Except for having 10 more RBI and an extra 10 pts on his avg - Curtis is behind Jackson in all offensive stats. (and those 10 extra RBI can be attributed to Curtis hitting behind Jackson)

Jose Tabata has been bad (.222 Avg 0 HR) but he also had hand surgery at the end of last summer and it often takes time for a player to regain his power after that.

Far too early in their respective careers to wash your hands at two of the Yankees top 10 prospects.

By the way, as long as we're on the topic of prospects - A guy I've been following for a few years made his season debut the other day.

Chris Garcia - a converted catcher who missed all of last season with TJ surgery and subsiquently hurt his leg while working out at the minor league complex pitched for High A Tampa.

4.2 IP, 6 hits, 2 R, 1 ER, 1 BB, 6 K. He was rated by Baseball America to have a nasty curve in the Joba Chamberlain, Phil Hughes mold with a plus fastball. If he's healthy he should zip through the system pretty quickly and could be a big reliever for the Yankees.

CHIP

Slight inaccuracies abound in your above statement:
Curtis is ahead of Jackson in
OPS
SLG
AVG
Runs
RBI
and he has no prospect hitting behind him.
if you check Curtis,Gardner,Tabata and Jackson they've all been in the minors 4 yrs and all have more or less the same type stats.Maybe Jackson for example has shown more power but he strikes out a ton Gardner is a singles hitter and Curtis and Tabata are somewhere in between.But nothing Tabata or Jackson have done so far indicates they are better players.Now if Jackson were hitting .350 w/power then we could say he's starting to arrive but outside of short bursts that hasn't been the case.Curtis may fly beneath the radar because he isn't as hyped as the others and could have slightly better power potential than indicated.

CHIP

So what are the Yanks going to do w/ all this relief ? Anyway the Yanks project Garcia as a starter .
Lots of relievers only 7 slots to fill.

Hand and wrist problems always have a negative effect on power numbers.

It took Matsui a full year to regain his power stroke after breaking his wrist in 2006. And this from a guy who has averaged 20-25 home runs a year.

I don't see why people gush over Brett Gardner.

Yes, he's fast. So is Juan Pierre and he sucks. Gardner can steal bases but he's been getting thrown out a lot too (12 SB, 6 CS). That's not a good percentage.

I don't see Gardner as much more than a fourth outfielder in the majors, but I hope he proves me wrong.

ruse,

Holiday for Melky and prospects.....not a chance. The Yanks don't have prospects worthy of an MVP trade. You always have to remember that other teams will be in the mix. So the Yanks have to out bid them. Melky is a starter on one team and one team only. Most teams he is a the 4th OF...especially in the NL. You have to remember the dynamics...NL has no DH so they require offensive production much more in the OF. Melky can't provide that and certainly isn't up to snuff with the glove As a CF his offense might be OK if he had a glove. As a corner OF he can't produce the Offensive numbers needed.

As for your assessment of Tabata and Jackson I think your right on. Neither is a serious contender for the bigs. Bottom line is the OF is a huge problem for the team in the coming years. I wouldn't be surprised to see them make an offer to Abreu

ruse -

Like I said earlier, you're entitled to your opinion. But here's something you should consider. This is Curtis's 2nd year (first full) at AA, whereas Jackson and Tabata are just breaking into the higher level. Take a look at how Curtis performed last season when he first broke in at AA. Certainly not impressive.

http://www.fangraphs.com/statss.aspx?playerid=$10227&position=OF

Again - not saying Curtis won't be a good player. Only saying that before throwing Tabata and Jackson out as busts I would give them more than half a year at AA.

Ruse,

Teams can't have enough good young arms in relief. A few of those arms may make an appearance this season, but Joba is going to the rotation eventually (this season or next) and Farnsworth and Hawkind will be gone after 2008.

That's three arms right there that the team is going to have to replace in the pen. Not all of these guys are going to work out so you have to try them out and see which arms can do the job.

The pen this season has done a really good job. This is why going with the young arms instead of signing journeymen is the better strategy when constructing a bullpen because they can be easily moved (back and forth to Scranton) if they don't work out.

Relievers making big money (ie: Farnsworth and Hawkins) can't always be moved.

Just my opinion - but the team that signs Matt Holliday to a big contract is making a HUGE mistake.

He profiles (physically) to age poorly - in the Giambi style.

Ruse -

Two months into the season and the Yankees have used what - 10 relievers? You can never have enough arms in the system.

Wow Chip,

Thats a real negative reach. He is 28 hitting over 300 3 of his 4 full seasons with power and RBI's and not aided by Roger Clemens cocktails. His numbers are better at the same age AND he plays a position, not just hiding at first hoping nothing gets hit to him.What similarilty to Giambi do you see?

Hey Nudge,

Is there a Yankee prospect that you do like?

You have a habit of downplaying all the Yankee youngsters so I'm wondering if any of them are worthy of the Nudge approval.

Probably not many if any at all.

Holliday also ave. 12 SB per season

VIPER

FYI Matsui came back the following yr and hit 25 HR on 1 leg I might add.

Nudge - A) Jason Giambi had FAR better numbers before his free agent year than Holliday. Holliday will be 29 turning 30 when he becomes a FA (same age as Jason) and Giambi had 6 years of top level production at that point (versus 2 for Holliday to this point)

and

B) how do you know that he's not on something? His power output doubled between 05 and 06. I'm not going to sit here and say that he is on something for certain, but I see no reason to believe for certain that he isn't.

By the way, color me shocked that you think the Yankees are in trouble going forward.

CHIP

Holliday just got better can you accept that?

Holliday has been a great player for 3 yrs and his 1st season was a good start in which he batted .290.

Giambi started juicing in 1998 when his productivity started to soar

Viper,

Being a realist not vested in the hype that comes from this front office...they don't have many that might make you feel confident that they will make a splash in the big leagues. Ever notice the hype is always for guys at A, AA.....then suddenly poof AAA comes and where are they? Guess they figured skipping AAA might make Hughes and Kennedy make it.

But to specifically answer your question I actually think Gardner has a shot on a team that needs a glove if CF as long as they don't expect power. All these other names are nothing till I see some success at AAA by the age of 23.

So the future is a bleak as I have described for 2 years. Its just becoming obvious to everyone else now.

Chip,

Do you know how to read? Because year for year comparing the two Hollidays numbers beat Giambi every year.

Giambi

.256 6 25
.291 20 79
.293 20 81
.295 27 110

.315 33 123 This year is age 28 which is the current year for Holliday

Holliday

.290 14 57
.307 19 87
.326 34 114
.340 36 137

.318 6 21 current year in progess.

Oh yeah....they test now and Giambi admitted what Holliday didn't have to so nice try.

Better average, power numbers and he can catch the ball. Plus he doesn't have to worry about all those post juice affects.

The two are on two different planets so if you think the team that gets Holliday is mistaken then cheer when the Sox pick him up.

Ruse

It's entirely possible. I was just responding to Nudge's certainty that Holliday isn't on the BALCO joy juice. I think it's foolish to say, given what we've seen over the last couple of years, that anyone is or isn't on something until there is a test to prove it. Or testimony.

Look at Giambi pre 98 and Holliday pre 06 - very similar numbers.

Then look at the jump each one too in 98 and 06 - again, very similar.

Holliday is probably a good bet for 200 hits each of the next 4 seasons and maybe beyond. Tup, don't want to take a chance on a guy like that.....especially if you have to give up Melky and some A ballplayer that Baseball America wrote a good article about.

The "Jump"? Thats funny. He played 25% more games the next year after recouping from and injury. So his 19 HR in 125 games translates into 24 in 155 games that he played the following year. That "jump" is now from 24 to 33...WOW a young player from age 25 to 26 actually developed more power. How unusual. Quick call the senate to investigate because my argument has been shot down 20 ways and Im out of BS to throw as a diversion.

CHIP

be reasonable .Holliday is an MVP caliber player .I'm sure he's given urine samples to some person who likes that sort of thing

Nudge - do you know how to subtract?

Giambi was born in 71 - thus in 01 (his walk year) he was turning 30. Now look at the six years leading up to the 01 season:

01 - 38 HR, 120 RBI, 1.137 OPS
00 - 43, 137, 1.123 OPS
99 - 33, 123, .975 OPS
98 - 27, 110, .873
97 - 20, 81, .857
96 - 20, 79, .836

Now look at Holliday (who has two more years until FA)

07- 36, 137, 1.012
06 - 34, 114, .973
05 - 19, 87, .866
04 - 14, 57, .837

Even if Holliday's 08 and 09 seasons are as good as his 07 was - the pattern is IDENTICAL to Giambi's.

ruse -

If there is one thing that Bud Selig, Don Fehr, and Victor Conte all agree on - it is that MLB's testing policy is a joke and will continue to be a joke until blood samples are taken.

How many times have we heard the term "masking agents" when talking about why urine samples are not good enough?

Again, my point had nothing to do with Holliday being on steroids or not - my point was strictly that signing him at 30 (I'll do the math for Nudge, he was born in 1980 which means that he'll be entering 30 as a newly signed player in 2010) to a long term deal would be a mistake if you think he's going to be an OF. Same reason people questioned Houston signing Carlos Lee - he's physically a DH in the making.

Babe Ruth from age 24-25 went from 29 HR to 54

Henry Arron from age 22-23 went from 26 HR to 44

Mickey Mantle age 22-23... 27 HR to 37 HR

Lou Gehrig age 23-24 ...16 to 47 HR

See Chip has proven it. People have been juicing since the beginning of baseball!

It's entirely possible. I was just responding to Nudge's certainty that FILL IN NAME TO SUPPORT CHIPS DELUSION isn't on the BALCO joy juice. I think it's foolish to say, given what we've seen over the last couple of years, that anyone is or isn't on something until there is a test to prove it. Or testimony.

Ruse -

One last thing - You're right: Holliday is an MVP calliber player. So was Giambi at that age.

CHIP

C'mon my friend cease and desist.

Nudge - do you know for sure that Matt Holliday is not on something? Have you drawn his blood and seen it under a microscope?

Because until that is done I will be skeptical that ANY player over the last 20 years is completely clean. That includes Matt Holliday, Derek Jeter, Luis Sojo, and Greg Maddux.

Nudge & Ruse - do you know for sure that Matt Holliday is not on something? Have you drawn his blood and seen it under a microscope?

Because until that is done I will be skeptical that ANY player over the last 20 years is completely clean. That includes Matt Holliday, Derek Jeter, Luis Sojo, and Greg Maddux.

Sorry for the double post.

I am a small, bitter, little man who has a need to come on here and spew my hate.

I am superior to all of you, at least hiding behind my keyboard. In real life I would get the cr#p beat out of me and passed around like a drunk chick at a frat party.

I know everything yet nothing and only use this forum to lash out at all the bullies who made my life miserable throughout the years.

My only conselation is that Viper is a bigger wimp than me...thank goodness!

Ruse,

Regarding Matsui's power numbers, the guy had 8 home runs last season on July 1, 2007 (over 249 ABs) - which was 14 months after he broke his wrist the season before.

From July 1, 2007 to October of last season, Matsui hit 17 home runs (over 302 ABs).

This was not something I made up. It was a big topic of discussion last season that it took Matsui's wrist over a year to completely heal before he regained his power stroke.