On the Yankees beat

Watch Gagne stay put when it's all said and done. As long as he doesn't go to Boston or we don't have to give up Horne, I'm happy.

I can see a Proctor for Betemit trade.

If we can deal Farnsworth, you do it, but why would anyone want him?

Looking forward to seeing Joba in the Bronx soon!

Farnsworth should be dealt for anything we can get.

I don't care if its for a bucket of balls and the teams worst minor league player.

Give up Farnsworth to any team for a "why not" deal.

I still think that a Farnsworth for Ensberg deal makes sense from the standpoint that the teams exchange a high priced problem they don't want.

The gist I get though is that the Yankees will trade EITHER Proctor or Farnsworth - I'm of the belief that they have a deal in place for Betemit but want to see if they can get something back for Farnsworth first, before pulling the trigger on that deal. Myself, I would be content moving both of them and having a pen of:
Rivera
Vizciano
Edwar Ramirez
Joba Chamberlain
Jeff Karstens
Villone
Myers/Henn/Bruney

hours to go and nothing to report of....

many internet baseball outlets (fox sports, si.com) have no updated info.

and to expect ESPN, the worldwide leader in sports, to have a ticker or updated, on the hour, blog, would be asking too much, huh?

as as yanks fan, im looking more forward to a-rod's 500th and/or hughes next start moreso than his dull deadline.

I want to see Edwar get a chance, but at the same time I want to see him prove himself. He has a solid changeup, but that doesn't make him "great". He struck out the side in his first appearance and everyone got excited, but I think it was premature. He's been a wonderer and you don't just become great. In the bullpen, I like change of pace guys, so he offers a change from some of the other bullpen guys and Roger, but not really for the rest of our starters (until Hughes is pitching). I think Igawa could be an effective relief option and should be used in that role in SWB for the next month or so while the "mechanics" work on him. If it works, he'd be an expensive reliever, but at least he'd be effective. I don't think he can ever be an effective starter.

hanging your hat on an awful lot of young/inexperienced pitchers coming out of the bullpen. although i guess it cant be much worse than whats coming out of the bullpen now.

Steve,

I know - but if the guys the Yankees have in the pen now can't throw strikes then their experience is moot.

Bruney, Proctor, and Farnsworth have phenomenal ability but their walk numbers are unacceptable - what good is it if you throw 96mph if a batter doesn't have to swing at it until you're in a position where he knows the ball will be right down the middle?

Steve-

if they can pitch effectively out of pen, whether its joba, karstens, edwar...then the upside is opposing teams know little or nothing about these guys. plus, their youth and energy could bode well for others (i.e. farnsworth, proctor, myers.

it was mentioned a few times recently...guys like f-rod of LAA and toehr have come up and helped teams throughout playoffs, even in WS.

and you are correct, bringing in young kids cant hurt with what we got down there already.

July 31, 2007
Waitin' for the word
By Gordon Edes, Globe Staff

Just touched base with one of my sources, and he told me the Red Sox are still waiting to hear back from the White Sox on Jermaine Dye. The ball is in the White Sox court, he said. Of course, it's an hour earlier in Chicago.

Nothing yet on Eric Gagne this a.m., though the reports out of Texas suggested that owner Tom Hicks may be trying to sign him to an extension and they're going to hold onto him.

Rivera's agent, Fern Cuza, said yesterday that they have no interest in negotiating a contract extension during the season. He expects Rivera to enter free agency.

Staff writers Jim Baumbach and Ken Davidoff contributed to this story

Im gone man, gone!

Cash....trade me or lose me.

That was me Cash.

I think the Rangers would be MORONS to keep Gagne as they can play the Mets and Yankees (and backpage paranoia) off of each other and get maybe 2 solid young players for him.

In the end, Saltalamacchia, the pitchers from Atlanta and the catcher from Cleveland (for Lofton) plus whomever they get for Gagne would be a nice rebuilding haul... especially when you consider Lofton wasn't coming back, Gagne is a long term injury risk and Teixera was out the door.

As for my boys... look, I thought it was a HUGE mistake trading Arroyo for Pena and the last year and a half has just proven me right. Pena is worthless off of the bench... might as well let him start and to have a former WS MVP who was a legit All Star a year ago platoon with Drew (or screw it, have Drew be the lefty off the bench and Dye start in right) seems like a no brainer to me.

I could see the yanks trying to negotiate a "career contract" with Mo. It would include using him, at a minimum, as a spring training instructor and special instructor to the team. I would say bullpen coach, but Mo has already indicated that he does not want to be a full-time coach as he'd prefer to spend the time with his family. I don't think anyone is worried. He and Posada will both stay and will both be there for the 2009 Stadium opening.

The Yankees grew discouraged about their chances of landing Rangers closer Eric Gagne on Tuesday morning, an indication that the reliever could be headed to one of three other teams trying to acquire him — the Red Sox, Brewers or Mets — or nowhere at all.

Cash....No Gagne, no Mo, no hope.

Man, remember when players like Fred McGriff, Randy Johnson, David Cone, Harold Baines and Willie McGee were available at the trade deadline?

Now people are salivating over a broken down Jermaine Dye, a "I can't believe he's not injured" Eric Gagne and Kyle Lohse.

KYLE LOHSE!
Or is it LOSHE?
I can't remember

More teams are standing pat.
And in some ways that's good.

But MAN I wish Ken Griffey Jr was being dealt to a contender. I love Griffey and would love to see him shine on the big stage again instead of languishing in the purgatory known as Cincinnati

Cash...dont seem so desperate, does he?

Yankees: Scott Proctor, Kyle Farnsworth. Proctor continues to draw interest from the Dodgers, Devil Rays and other clubs. The Yankees are "begging" to get rid of Farnsworth, a rival executive says.

Gagne is going somewhere
The Rangers are doing the whole "Maybe we'll keep him" as a ploy.

I still think it will be the Yankees but I also think the Yankees will blink and send Joba knowing that if they don't it will be Farnsworth in big spots for the rest of the year.

Farnsworth for Ensberg makes sense I guess. Do you play Ensberg at first base or just have him as "A-Rod is leaving" insurance?

I don't like the Proctor/Betemit deal. You might as well start Duncan at first. Proctor hasn't been terrible and "not terrible" is a HUGE step up from Myers/Farnsworth

Don't sacrifice pitching for the bench.

(Don't believe me? See the Arroyo for Pena trade that torpedoed the 2006 season for my boys)

Cash...whats the deal, dont no Tampa pitcher be better than your rebuilt farm staff..or you just lying to us like you lied to me?

Finally, give the Devil Rays credit for aggressively trying to fix their bullpen, adding not just Wheeler, but also Class AAA right-hander Calvin Medlock and left-hander Brian Shackelford for infielder Jorge Cantu and right-hander Grant Balfour for righty Seth McClung.
Balfour, 29, has been terrific at Class AAA this season, though he struggled mightily in a brief call-up with the Brewers. The Yankees were among the teams that were hoping he might come available on waivers.

Sully,

Trading Arroyo for Wily Mo wasn't a mistake - The way Pena is being used is what is making it look like a mistake and Arroyo is benefiting from the NL lineups - but after his stellar year last season scouting reports are evidently catching up to him.

You're right that Pena needs to play everyday to be effective, but Boston has no place to play him since he's not a particularly good outfielder and DH is taken - If you could get Chad Cordero for him - that would be a good trade for both organizations.

Some baseball trade blog chat.....

7/29/2007
2:01 PM I'm sorry. I should adjust the way I state my sarcastic little remarks- like the one I used to refer to the very last sentence of Rosenthal's article- so that some dim-witted yankees fans don't get offended.
First, what are the yankees? Buyers or Sellers? Obviously, if they're sellers, they shouldn't even be talking to Jon Daniels. But apparently they've asking about Eric Gagné's last two months of his contract, so let's just say they're buyers. If so, then it doesn't seem like they're going to make much of a splash given their reluctance to trade their young players. So now, if the Yankees REALLY WANT to do what you think they do, then they are trying to trade those players in exchange for prospects they can use in other trades. But what exactly would they get for Farnsworth? Who has NEVER had consecutive seasons of below-4.00 ERA. Or Giambi, who's past success was due to some "stuff" that he did. And please tell me how many contenders are looking for an overpaid CF? Better overpay for a good one in the offseason.

Maybe the Yankees don't need to pull off a blockbuster. Maybe all they need is go get Dan Johnson and Shawn Chacon. Yes! That'd put them ahead of the Red Sox or the other AL Central team that's leading the Wild Card race. Here's something they should be thinking about: Give up. They are not winning this year. And if they trade away their prospects, they are not going to win in 09 or 2010 either. Just bite the bullet, and start thinking about what they're going to do with their undesirable contracts.

ESPN: Yankees get infielder Betemit from L.A. for reliever Proctor

Sully,

I don't see Cashman blinking on Joba - he didn't blink on Hughes last year for Abreu. I think the Yankees are trying to drive the price on relievers down by saying they are so comfortable with Joba as a possible part out of the pen that they are willing to deal away relievers. Sort of saying "we're not desperate for pen help, so don't think you can rob us. Don't believe me, here, we'll give you a reliever that's how confident we are."

I like Proctor but he walks far too many players (29 in 52 IP) couple that with allowing more than a hit per inning and he has been just as bad as Farnsworth (21 BB in 41 IP) combine that with Bruney who has also given out too many free passes and you've got three guys who just aren't getting the job done - plus I think there is a sentiment in the organization that Proctor is a year away from going the way of Tanyon Sturtze.

Cash....No Proctor, no Gagne, no MO, no Gravitas

Dodgers Betemit to Bronx?'
The deal the Yankees want is to send Scott Proctor to the Los Angeles Dodgers for the utilityman Wilson Betemit, a deal they discussed last July with Betemit's former team, the Braves. The thinking is that Proctor's arm may be vulnerable, considering how often he has pitched the last two seasons. A National League scout, who did not want to comment publicly on a potential deal not involving his club, said Betemit, a .263 career hitter, was nothing special. But the scout said the deal still made sense for the Yankees because Proctor seemed exhausted despite throwing hard. -- NY Times

he Dodgers and Yankees have agreed in principle on a trade that would send reliever Scott Proctor to the Dodgers for infielder Wilson Betemit, sources told ESPN The Magazine's Buster Olney.

The Dodgers, who have a 5.61 bullpen ERA since the All-Star break, have been in on a number of relievers but zeroed in on Proctor over the last 24 hours.

The Yankees view Betemit as another first-base/DH/bench option for this year, and a potential third-base replacement for Alex Rodriguez next year.

Betemit is batting .231 with 10 home runs and 26 RBIs this season off the Dodgers' bench. Proctor is 2-5 with a 3.81 ERA in 54 1/3 innings out of the Yankees' bullpen.

Cash...this is the D-boy you need. Is Omar yo daddy or what?

Mets eye Rays closer?
The Mets also have expressed interest in Tampa Bay closer Al Reyes, but they were facing stiff competition for his services from the Seattle Mariners and others. -- Star-Ledger

I don't understand this infatuation w/ Betemit. I'm not happy w/ this trade at all.

Chip, I think the world of you... but Arroyo for Pena was a stupid trade then and it was a stupid trade now. That's why I called up Dibble/Kennedy on XM screaming about it hours after it was made.

The Sox went into 2006 with Schilling, Wells, Foulke and Beckett all as injury candidates.

Arroyo, while not a superstar, was at least a healthy young pitcher and was practically the only one that they DIDN'T label as injury prone.

So what did they do? Trade the one pitcher without health issues for a guy who sat on the bench

I'm not even counting the year Arroyo had because I knew that was kind of a fluke. But guess what happened... to the surprise of NOBODY. All of those pitchers got hurt!

So the Sox spent the year not only without an effective #5 starter, but without a #4 starter and for part of the year no #3 starter.

And that wore down the bullpen... and it was a domino effect to the disaster last year.

So the Reds got a starter and we got a guy hogging the sunflower seeds. Even the Sox knew it was a mistake as they signed JD Drew (the worst free agent signing in the history of the Boston Red Sox) to take over.

So let's review.
Healthy young starter dealt for benchwarmer.

Pitching staff falls apart.
Benchwarmer sits.

The next season benchwarmer replaced and is offered around the league as bait.

Now... explain to me why that doesn't fall under the "Boy did THAT suck!" category?

Cash....who ya keepin and who ya dealin? Dont make no sense.

Yanks Igawa to Padres?
The Yankees recently demoted left-handed pitcher Kei Igawa, for whom the Padres bid $10 million last offseason. The Padres view Igawa as a potential "buy-low" acquisition, but the Yankees aren't making him readily available. -- San Diego Union-Tribune

I like this deal for both sides.

In Betemit the Yankees get an offensive upgrade and switch hitter over Andy Phillips - as good as Andy has been I think Wilson is better. He's young and hopefully with regular playing time that batting average will come up. And he's a little more insurance against Alex leaving so the Yankees could a) keep Cano at 2nd and b) not dabble in the Joe Crede, Mike Lowell markets.

Proctor goes back to where things started for him and he gives the Dodgers a good arm out of the pen. Playing in a big park will also hopefully keep him from giving up so many homers.

Good luck Scott.

I think deal Farnsworth for Ensberg and throw him at first base and keep Proctor.

Seriously, Proctor isn't bad.
Now's not the time to DEPLETE your pen!

White Sox want Delcarman or Justin Masterson along with Pena for Dye...Red Sox want Dye because of Ortiz knee and shoulder problems--Drew has been a bust and they fear Lowell and Youkilis will fade in the second half like they did last year...Interesting that Dye,who is 33yrs.old and is hitting 233, has listed Boston as one of only four teams covered in his no trade clause.

Gagne, who also has Sox listed in his no trade clause, would cost the Sox a prized prospect;either Buchholz,Lester or Ellsbury. Report is that the Sox are worried that Timlin and Donnelly can't perform and Papelbon has lost some velocity.

Question is why would the Sox go after players who don't want to play in Boston?

Cash....Joes got my vote but I wont be here next year either.

Jeter: Torre doing a great hob
Joe Torre's club might miss the playoffs for the first time in his dozen years as the Yankees' manager. And there is a very strong chance that the Torre Era has two months left in it since his contract expires whenever the Yankees' season does. Yet, to Derek Jeter, Torre might be doing his finest managing job in pinstripes. "He does a great job every year," Jeter said of Torre, the only manager he has played for. "This has definitely not been an easy year by any stretch of the imagination so you can say it's his best. He has done a great job." -- NY Post

Proctor is replaceable and can garnish a return. Myers/Farnsworth, they can't.

Myers has actually been effective, just not in the role the Yanks got him to be effective in.

Farnsworth/Ensberg and the Yanks pay half of Farny's salary next year.

Do the Yanks go after Jeff Kent this winter for 1b? See if they can sign him to a 1 year deal and then pursue Tex the following year when Giambi's contract is off the books?

Sully,

You're right...trading a starting pitcher for a bench player isn't a good idea - but looking at it from Theo's point of view, and I hate defending him, but when he made the trade he didn't anticipate that Papelbon was going to end up the closer, and Lester was going to get cancer.

He was looking at 7 starters and a weak bench so he thought he had room to wiggle. I would not have done the trade though, not without a position to play Wily Mo on a regular basis.

"Buckwheat" Olney is reporting the R\Sox are the "front runner" to get Gagne. Cashman has really "botched" the trade negotiations with Texas. The Yanks could have acquired both TEX and Gagne by giving up Chamberlain. Now, the Res\Sox are looking to improve their team by adding Gagne, and the Yanks are "scrambling" to get Gagne and patch a bullpen that is "leaking" badly. Reports are now coming out that the Proctor for Betemit deal has been consumated. We are now down 1 reliever, desperately trying to "dump" another,(Farns), and just as desperately trying to "plug the dike" with Gagne. Cashman has created a calamity, that could have been easily avoided.

Cash...Omar is your daddy. Are you even in the game? Molina...Betemit, wheres George when you need him?

Twins get prospect hitting .187 from Mets
The Twins picked up Class AA catcher Drew Butera and Class A center fielder Dustin Martin from the Mets. Don't expect to see Martin or Butera, son of former Twins catcher Sal Butera, in the Twin Cities for a few seasons. Butera, batting .188 in 30 games with Class AA Binghamton, has been assigned to New Britain, while Martin, who was hitting .287 with Class A Port St. Lucie, is moving to Fort Myers. Butera is "a good catch-throw guy. He's having a little trouble hitting at Double-A, but he hit well in A ball," Terry Ryan said. "The other kid has some power. So there's two players that we consider prospects, but they're a ways away." -- Pioneer Press

hughes,

I think I read where Kent said he's retiring after this season

the latest from ESPN radio
Proctor is traded to Dodgers for the infielder Betemit; Dye is going to RedSox for Pena and Gagne is either going to Mets, RedSox or Brewers

I agree to a degree about Cash and not trading Joba, Chip.

However I also think that the Yankees KNOW their bullpen is the key to winning the Wild Card (or even the AL East if they go on a HUGE run).

And Vizcaino pitching the 7th, Gagne the 8th and Rivera the 9th suddenly makes the Yankees formidable.

Pound the hell out of other teams middle relief and take the lead by the 7th or 8th and suddenly the Yankees might go on a 8 or 9 game win streak.

Also, we all know this is probably Torre's last year. He just looks tired and Christ he's been the Yankee manager for 12 years and is going to the Hall of Fame and having his number retired.

Does Cash REALLY want Torre's Yankee career to end in Camden Yards on Sept 30 playing a meaningless play-out-the-string game? Or does he want to give him one last chance of post season glory?

If letting go of Joba is the only thing preventing that last shot for Torre... then I think Joba might be gone.

I could be wrong, but it wouldn't surprise me

The man of steel never retires...never even takes a day off...except to fly Lois around the world backwards...but then I ...I mean the man of steel gets the day back.

Chip... you and I have found common ground.

God bless this board.

If Willy Mo had turned into the second coming of Andre Dawson, I would have eaten crow.

Great- we got a platoon player and dealt one of the few halfway decent relievers we have.

Cashman, not sure why they pursue players who don't want to come to Boston.

Maybe they hope that a weekend in Boston and a cup of Legal Seafood Chowder would change their mind.

Or maybe millions of dollars in an extension.

I like the Dye move. He could be a player who has a nice couple of months like Will Clark had with the Cardinals that year or Dave Justice had with the Yankees. Not asking for a whole year... just a good August and September.

Hell, if the Sox could get a good few weeks out of Julio Lugo like they've had since the break, anything is possible

Should Gagne go to the R\Sox, the AL East race is over, and they are the AL favorites to advance to the World Series. Cashman should be getting paid by the R\Sox.

Great- we got a platoon player and dealt one of the few halfway decent relievers we have. What's wrong with Phillips at first?

CHip - if alex leaves the Yanks will throw the world for Rolen.

Yes I said it. yeah Rolen can be injury prone but the D and CLutch hitting would be a nice fit.

Jeter and the managerial stance is food for thought.

That may

Ben (NYC): Rob, have the Yankees swung too far to the other end of the spectrum, becoming over-protective of prospects where once they were too willing to let them go? Retaining Hughes, Chamberlain, and Kennedy makes sense, but they don't seem willing to deal anyone in a minor league uniform. According to reports, they've turned down Brett Gardner for Dan Johnson, and Alan Horne for Gagne; mistakes, or sound policy?

SportsNation Rob Neyer: (12:28 PM ET ) Well, those are just rumors, right? We don't *know* -- or at least I don't know -- which deals the Yankees have turned down. I think they could trade a prospect for somebody who can help. But I also think they're plenty good enough, right now, to get into the playoffs.

Should Gagne go to the R\Sox, the AL East race is over, and they are the AL favorites to advance to the World Series. Cashman should be getting paid by the R\Sox.

Switching balls before every at bat of a player appraoching a milestone has to be the dumbest move yet. The game stops while the balls are changed (and then changed back) You put the hole Defense and the pitcher on notice. Maybe if Arod continues to pile up the walks, someone will wake up. This is all to prevent 30 people from coming forward and saying that they caught Arod's 500th HR? MLB makes how much money? and they can only afford to mark 6 baseballs?

I for one would Love to play in Boston next year. Have Theo give my boy a call and set it up. I will even play for less money so Cash can take all da heat is deserves.

I still don't understand why Chris Britton isn't being seriously considered for the BP. Is it because people think he is still too green or is it because of the weight issues?

How effective does he have to be in AAA to get noticed (for real)?

Sully,

Glad we could hit common ground.

I kind of tipped my hand on Gagne earlier in the board. I think there is a difference between being "Great" and being "Best Available" and that Gagne, at this stage, fits squarely into the second category.

Mariano ain't coming to Boston.

I think the Yankees will come to their senses and resign him (see the Bernie Williams negotiations in 1998).

But Posada is a different story.

I can see him in another uniform (the Cubs? the Giants? the Angels?) and the Yankees bring him back for the 2010 season as a reserve

Britton would be a good righty-righty matchup pitcher, but he hasn't proved he can get lefty's out consistently. His numbers are good in SWB, but not spectacular when taken in context. Koz is another relief pitcher there that has good numbers and may deserve a shot.

I think the Proctor trade signals that the Yankees have worked out a deal to grab Gagne. Potentially Horne/Gardner for Gagne. The Yanks are holding out trying to squeeze something else out of it.

Sully,

I think Jorge could wind up with the Mets next season.

Gagne is a nice pick up for whomever gets him.

Interesting the Dodgers aren't making a lot of noise for him.

For the Red Sox it would be a luxury. He'd be the 7th inning guy and give Papelbon a rest now and then. I would LOVE that, but I don't see it happening.

I'm surprised the Braves didn't just open up the farm for Teixera AND for Gagne. Or maybe you think Bob Wickman is a post season closer!

The Red Sox want him but the Yankees and Mets NEED him... which is why I think he is going to New York.

Actually the team that needs him the most is Cleveland. They could have a first round home field advantage or miss the playoffs altogether depending on how they fix their pitching staff.

I still think Gagne is going to the Yankees... and all of these rumors that Cashman blew it will only fuel the need to include Joba the Hutt in any deal.

You makin me repeat myself.... it aint Yanks decision..its mine.

Rivera's agent, Fern Cuza, said yesterday that they have no interest in negotiating a contract extension during the season. He expects Rivera to enter free agency.

Staff writers Jim Baumbach and Ken Davidoff contributed to this story

Cashman loses his job if he trades one of the top 3 pitching prospects.

Maybe Chip

But suddenly the Angels catching corps is depleted... and Arte Moreno likes to make a splash

Also the Cubs have tried everyone short of digging up the body of Bill Dickey at catcher.

The Yanks better not get rid of Joba for Gange

That would be dumb.

Give up Kennedy and Clippard/Chase

Then dump Farnsworth for whatever, and move in Joba

HughesYourDaddy,

Cashman loses his job if the Yankees miss the playoffs.

He's kind of between a rock and a hard place. Sacrifice the future to win the Wild Card?

Hold on to the future and watch some other GM reap the benefit?

Yooo mon...I would trade aaaaanytin for Gange.

Proctor for Betemit has happened.

Stupid stupid trade

I think George will surprise everyone at the end of the season and hold onto Cashman. This isn't the old George and he's going to be ridding himself of Torre. He won't gun down both. He put Cashman "on the hook" because it made more sense to the team's chemistry than Torre. That's all. The team makes the playoffs without Gagne. They make opposing teams shutter with him, but I think Joba is MUCH more qualified long term and possibly short-term as well. He's a stud and he's for real.

Before anyone goes crazy over who gets Gagne-

Some closers have troouble adjusting to set-up. Gagne had the greatest streak ever for a closer and it is part of his persona. It is unclear how he would do in the 8th inning.

He has also been hurt for the past two years and I think has pitched something like 30 innings this year.

The Yankees are smart not to give up a top prospect for him. If the Red Sox get him, it doesn't necesarily make them better, as he may have trouble adjusting to the 8th inning, and he upsets the roles of guys already there (Joujima, Timlin, etc). Of course, if Papelbon were to get injured ( as he did late last year), then Gagne would be insurance for the closer role.

I think Betamint is a good deal because he could be another role player like Vizciano or Sojo. And Proctor is never going to be anymore than what he is- an average middle reliever who walks too many people.

Gabbard and Murphy are scrub players. Texas Gm should be fired If This trade happens. The Redsox are trying to overhyped this mediocre pitchers like Gabbard and Murphy. Remember Casey Fossum and Brandon Lyon for Curt Schilling? What a Joke ?

You dont think the Yanks would trade Proctor if they dont have Gagne? Would they

Sully,

The Braves have a deal in place to get Octavio Dotel for Kyle Davies.

I'm not saying you're wrong about the Angels or Cubs, I just think given the fact that Posada knows Willie and Gary Tuck (their pen coach who served with the Yankees as Catching instructor when Posada was younger) has spent his entire pro career in New York the Mets would be the front runners for his services (after the Yankees)

I think Cashman will stick to his guns on Horne, Chamberlain, and Kennedy.

Gagne can veto a deal to Boston and may do just that if he knows he's going there to be the 7th inning guy, I think the leaked rumors are more or less Boston's way of trying to drive the price up on the Yankees and at the same time by sticking to their guns and working out Chamberlain in the pen the Yankees are trying to drive the price down into the Ty Clip/Chase Wright and Brett Gardner range.

I just read on ESPN.com where the Red Sox are close to getting Dye for Pena and a reliever - I'm sure curious how they are going to get him that many at bats. Sit Drew? Sit Crisp and play Drew in CF?

Do you really think the Yankees will be able to retain A-Rod for next year ?

If Cashman wants to think big picture trade A-Rod now to Angels for K-Rod and John Lackey

I like that Gabbard has gone 4-0 with a CG SHO this year.

Maybe that was classic "trade deadline auditioning."

I like Murphy but I like Ellsbury better.

I understand your point cs07 and it is quite valid. Randy Myers couldn't handle the set up role and Sparky Lyle didn't exactly shine in it.

But as a Sox fan knowing they could go Okajima in the 7th, Gagne in the 8th and Papelbon in the 9th and still have Del Carmen in the pen with the Timlins, Tavarezes, Snyders and Lopezes mopping up, it makes me happy.

Seriously, what other staff has 4 good relievers in the pen these days? Maybe San Diego.

Gabbard and Murphy for Gagne, I make that trade 7 days a week and twice on Sunday...

Stregthen OUR pen and keep him from the Yankees.

Sully,

It's like what I said about Gagne being good or just being better than what's out there. Proctor hasn't been good, he has just been better than Kyle Farnsworth. And if I'm right about him going the way of Tanyon Sturtze, better to get something for him when his trade value is high.

Remember, the guy is a 30 year old relief pitcher with 1 good season to his record.

Sully,
My point is are the Sox concerns about the team legit.
Dye is not worth Delcarmen or Masterson for just two months and Gagne for one of your top three prospects is not going to happen unless the report on Papelbon is true.

Proctor has been traded for Betimet, its official.

Chip,

Randy (Bos): The idea that I heard was a couple of games per week platooning with JD and then giving Manny and Ortiz a day off a week (Papi, especially, could use some regular rest given his injuries) and that's 4 games right there.

Rob Neyer: (12:46 PM ET ) Yeah, I think that's right. Crisp can take the occasional day off, too. Toss in the occasional injury, and getting Dye five games per week isn't that tough.

Hughes, I think you are right. THe Yanks probably have worked out a deal for Gagne, otherwise the Betemit deal makes no sense (and still might not). Am I the only one that has noticed that both Phillips and Cairo (while not long term answers) have both done their jobs when called upon? Proctor has been the only consistently reliable arm the last two years outside of Rivera, and since we are looking to dump Farnsworth, this only makes sense if another deal is lined up.

Sully and others, no way Joba is going. Book it. My fear is that Kennedy will be shipped off in a package deal for Gagne, but no way a young power arm goes. I'm not going to go on and on to make a point, but many of the WS winners the last decade or so featured one or two really good power arms, and the Yanks aren't giving one away for an injury prone set-up man. I don't need the usual littany of responses that "so and so is not a lock to be anything." I get it....

Hughes

Well that answers that. Thanks.

I think the Yankees could retain A-Rod next year but it will cost them HUUUUUUGE money.

So huge that even the Yankees might gulp.

Plus there are three teams with money to spend who could make a great big splash with an A-Rod signing.

Los Angeles, Anaheim (I refuse to call them Los Angeles) and San Francisco.

Plus if the Cubs sale goes through, their new owners might want to make a splash as well.

The Yankees certainly are in the mix, but I wonder if a fresh start in a nicer city (with better strip clubs) might be nice for A-Rod.

Yeah, he never won a ring in NY. Neither did Dave Winfield... did that hurt HIS legacy?

If he goes to Anaheim, he might win 2 or 3 rings.

do you think they'll wait for another appearance from chamberlain before they call him up?

and how come all of a sudden joba is a big deal. He never made prospect top 20 lists and no one ever said he was better than phil hughes until now?

Sully,

Mets have

Wagner
Heilman
Feliciano
Smith

I think Dye would get some starts and allow Crisp, Drew and Ortiz to have a day off from time to time.

With Crisp hitting and playing good CF, I wouldn't f--- with him too much.

It's all about depth.

I hope they keep DelCarmen. He's seemed to have found his major league arm and we need those in the pen.

Pitching depth wins post season games. (See the Yankees, 1996-2001)

A-Rod stays IF:

1. He wants to
2. Instead of tearing up his existing contract the Yankees and Boras are able to negotiate an extension on the deal that allows part of his salary over the next 3 years to be paid by the Rangers. If they tear up the current contract the Yankees would be on the freight for the whole thing and I don't get the sense they want that.

Michaelz:
Proctor has been just as erratic as Bruney and Farnsworth. The Yankees couldn't keep all three of them and Proctor, by virtue of his one good year last season, had the highest trade value of the three - it made sense to move him.

Betemit brings the dimension of a switch hitter to the plate - at this point I think the Yankees were just obsessed with him though - they had this same deal on the table last season when he was with the Braves. I think that more than this year they just really like him as Alex insurance.

CHIP- Gagne's stats this season, and the last couple months specifically, show he is "good". Just asking that question shows your not "on your game".

Buster:

Simple answer on Chamberlain not being highly ranked until this year - this is his first year of professional baseball.

The Yankees drafted him just over a year ago.

And gagne couldn't help with that bunch?

Arod, huge money, isn't bad as long as it's an extension. Pay him the money that will be saved on Giambi, Mussina, et al.

Key is EXTENSION! Keep Texas on the hook.

and most people project hughes as ultimately a #2 starter and joba an ace?

Roy,

Gagne has already had one stint on the DL - and with his history and the amount he has thrown thus far - another one could be lurking around the corner. Same question marks about Dotel.

Don't buy the hype Roy. He can't be a difference maker if he can't pitch everyday (ala Kyle Farnsworth)

The following is not a legal contractual option in accordance with the players agreement or the rules of major league baseball.

2. Instead of tearing up his existing contract the Yankees and Boras are able to negotiate an extension on the deal that allows part of his salary over the next 3 years to be paid by the Rangers. If they tear up the current contract the Yankees would be on the freight for the whole thing and I don't get the sense they want that.

This would technique would void the contract and subject the host team to league penalty as well as further legal action by the Texas Rangers.

The Proctor\Betemit deal had nothing to do with A-OPT insurance, and everything to do with getting the most you can for a pitcher who has been "over-worked" the last 2 seasons. It was a "trade this guy before his arm falls off" deal.

Buster:

That's exactly right.

From the things I've read (Baseball America, Baseball Prospectus, ESPN) Hughes is extremely polished, has a great curve but Joba has far better "stuff" and terrific command. I have not seen him pitch except for the Future's Game so I can't comment on that. The question with him coming out of the draft was his weight and a prior arm injury - neither of which have been an issue this season.

Sully, I dont' want to be rude (as you seem like a nice enough sock's fan), but analysis of the Sox's strengths and woes belong on a Sox blog, not a Yankee blog. It's not our fault that most sox's fans are losers.

Chip, I just don't see what Betemit brings to the table. How much of an upgrade over Cairo (who is average at best) is he really? Proctor may be on the verge of burning his arm out, but without another arm, considering we need to replace worthless in the eighth inning, who else can be trusted out of that pen besides Vizcaino?

If his arm falls off I will represent him in a suit against the Yankees and Joe Torre pro bono.

there is no way a man with 32 career HR's is starting @ 3b for the Yankees next year. you have a better chance seeing Bush in a Koufie

A lil something about Hughes...

Fastball: Hughes would be an effective pitcher with a 90 mph fastball. That said, Phil Hughes is going to be more than an effective pitcher. He is capable of throwing 96-97 mph, but prefers to sit comfortably at 93-94 or 94-95 on a good day in order to command it better. That said, he is capable of reaching back and throwing a located fastball at 97 if the situation commands it. He locates his fastball with the best of them. Think Curt Schilling as a comparison for the fastball.

Curveball: Two years ago, Hughes did not throw a curveball. Maybe he knew how to toss one on the side in the backyard, but he couldn't throw it in a game. What happened? Nardi Contreras told him to shelf his slider and use a curveball instead. What did Phil Hughes do? He almost immediately began to throw one of the best if not the best curveball in the minor leagues. It is a deadly strikeout weapon that lands on it's spot every time, with a solid 1-7 break.

Changeup: When Hughes made the decision to not throw his plus slider and instead focus all of his breaking effort on the curveball, it quickly became clear that he would need a 3rd pitch. Enter the changeup. He throws a 78-79 mph changeup fairly well, although it is not as developed as his other pitches. That will change. The Yankees put him on a constant diet of changeups throughout the 2006 season, forcing him to throw it as often as his curveball. It worked. He is still a step away from throwing the changeup in any situation (he goes to his curve with men on), but he is getting a better feel for it. Hughes would benefit from a few innings in AAA to finally nail it down without the big league pressure on him. Right now it will sometimes make hitters look foolish or sometimes fall way out of the strike zone. If Hughes' track record is at all predictive, expect him to throw it as well as he does his fastball.

Slider: While he still occassionally throws it on the side, Hughes does not throw his slider in games anymore. It used to be his signature pitch, but he has taken so well to the curveball that the Yankees see no reason to throw both. Hughes himself says that he struggles to command two different breaking balls at once.

Command: Lots of pitchers have a 65 fastball, 70 curveball, and 60 changeup. Phil Hughes compliment them with 70 control. He can put his fastball and curveball wherever he wants, in any count, without fail. He barely walks anyone. He barely leaves anything on the broader part of the plate for the home run. If a ball bounces in the dirt, he meant to do it. He has a career BB/9 ratio of 2.05 (which is roughly Mike Mussina level). He is a smart pitcher who always thinks one step ahead of the batter.

Joe

I'm not so sure about that - if the Yankees negotiate an extension on the back of a currently existing contract they are not altering the terms of the existing contract in any way - the Yankees would be responsible in total for the years added to the deal, but the Rangers would still be responsible for their portion of Alex's currently existing contract per the terms of their trade agreement.

That's part of the reason the Yankees have said they are willing to discuss an extension but will not bid on him if he opts out.

A lil something about Joba...

Fastball: Chamberlain is a big guy. He has a big fastball. Chamberlain throws 94-97 with plenty of life. There were reports out of Hawaii that he was being clocked at 98-99. Chamberlain's weight problem prevented him in the past from maintaining his ideal fastball throughout the later stages of each start, but he has whipped himself into shape over the last two years. More on his weight later. Chamberlain locates his fastball with the best of them.

Changeup: Chamberlain has an average 80-82 mph changeup. The Yankees are working on it and believe that it has a chance to become significantly better. He has throw it a lot in Hawaii, using it to get ahead in the counts.

Slider: Chamberlain has an above average to plus slider, which is his strikeout pitch. A typical power pitcher, you can imagine how he uses it. He has command with it, rarely leaving it up in the zone (although, like most pitchers, he can't really get a called strike with it). It is his best secondary pitch.

Curveball: Chamberlain has an above average curveball. Chamberlain may or may not abandon it as his primary "slow" pitch in favor the changeup. Lately the Yankees have been encouraging curveballs over sliders for their high school draft picks, so we'll see how Chamberlain goes.

Command: Chamberlain has plus control, but not plus command. Of course, he has the advantage of throwing 97. He'll pound the zone for strikes, but won' tbe able to hit a one inch box like Kennedy or Clippard, but he won't walk the ballpark either. Unlike those two, Chamberlain can afford to lay the occasional fastball over the middle of the plate. He illustrated his control in the HBL this winter, striking out 46 while somehow walking 3.

Performance: Chamberlain does not have an Ian Kennedy resume. He played for one year for a Division II college, weighing close to 290 pounds. He had a strong fastball but not much else, posting an ERA ove 5.00. He transfered to Nebraska, and set about improving his weight. The results were excellent, and he pitched 118.2 innings of of 2.81 ERA ball. He struck out 130 while walking just 33 and allowing just 7 home runs. He entered 2006 as a top-5 pitching prospect in the draft, but a triceps injury scared a lot of people away. His performance suffered early on, although he would eventually recovery and end the season well. He pitched 89.1 innings of 3.93 ERA ball, striking out 102 and walking 34. He allowed 8 home runs. The injury scared scared off a lot of people, causing Chamberlain to sink to the Yankees at the 41st pick. He signed late, preventing him from pitching in Staten Island. Instead, the Yankees sent him to Hawaii, where he blossomed. He pitched 37.