E-Boland and the Bombers

So, having learned what the Rangers wanted, i'm glad the Yanks did nothing. Gagne for 2 months is not worth Melkey or Kennedy with additional prospects i'm sorry.

Proctor has always been a class act, even when he's walked home the winning run on occasion.

It's absolutely UNFORGIVABLE if Cashman doesn't resign Mo. He's one of the ten best yankees of all time. period.

I've been hearing that this guy is getting on in years? Please.

He didn't start closing until he was about 25 or 26 and he had Tommy John surgery back when he was a starter.

So you point out his stats are worse this year? He's had no opportunities. Everybody knows that closers pitch worse in non-save situations. Joe has been forced to put Mo in lopsided games just to get him some action. His inflated ERA (and we're talking 3.00 which is impressive for your average closer. Hell, the wild card leader's closer has a 5+ ERA) is tied to the team's poor play thus far.

Look, Cash made the right moves keeping the big 3 kids but agreeing to negotiate with ARod and Mo and Jorge who gave you a dynasty? You need to check yourself.

RESIGN MARIANO AT ALL COSTS

and also give big Z $20m per.

Proctor has always been a class act, even when he's walked home the winning run on occasion.

It's absolutely UNFORGIVABLE if Cashman doesn't resign Mo. He's one of the ten best yankees of all time. period.

I've been hearing that this guy is getting on in years? Please.

He didn't start closing until he was about 25 or 26 and he had Tommy John surgery back when he was a starter.

So you point out his stats are worse this year? He's had no opportunities. Everybody knows that closers pitch worse in non-save situations. Joe has been forced to put Mo in lopsided games just to get him some action. His inflated ERA (and we're talking 3.00 which is impressive for your average closer. Hell, the wild card leader's closer has a 5+ ERA) is tied to the team's poor play thus far.

Look, Cash made the right moves keeping the big 3 kids but agreeing to negotiate with ARod and Mo and Jorge who gave you a dynasty? You need to check yourself.

RESIGN MARIANO AT ALL COSTS

and also give big Z $20m per.

excuse me ladies and gentlemen. i would like to inform you that as of now, we are at war with the ninjas. god bless america. and watch out for ninjas.

Keith Law- Gagne gives Red Sox a big boost
[quote]

http://insider.espn.go.com/espn/blog/index?name=law_keith

By acquiring Eric Gagne, the Red Sox fortified their bullpen, which wasn't a weakness for them but was top-heavy. Adding another good reliever to the late-inning mix helps them redistribute the workload of leveraged innings across more quality arms, and can help them avoid using Jonathan Papelbon -- he of the shoulder that allegedly wouldn't let him be a closer -- too many days in a row. They also kept Gagne away from the three other American League contenders looking for relief help, particularly the Yankees, who traded away Scott Proctor but didn't add any arms from outside the organization.

In exchange, the Rangers got ... stuff. David Murphy and Kason Gabbard are both big-league ready, but neither is an above-average player, and Murphy is more of a fourth outfielder or a fringe regular in center field than a solid everyday player. He does have decent plate discipline, but despite his size doesn't get a lot of loft on the ball, hitting singles and doubles to the gaps but not enough of them to be a regular in a corner spot. The Red Sox sold high on Gabbard, a pitchability lefty who has succeeded in seven big-league starts by relying on his defense, which has helped keep his hit rate ridiculously low. He has good sink on his fastball, which is otherwise below-average, and hides the ball extremely well.

The wild card here for Texas is center fielder Engel Beltre, a 17-year-old signed for about $600,000 out of the Dominican Republic in 2006. Beltre is an exciting player with a lot of ability. He has a clean swing with some loft in it, a plus arm, and he might be able to stay in center. If not, his bat will play in an outfield corner. He's playing in the Gulf Coast League at an age when most Dominican prospects are still playing in the Dominican Summer League, and he's holding his own, with five homers (tied for eighth in the league) and a .198 isolated power (10th in the league). I like the Rangers' willingness to take a short-season prospect in each of their two deals this week (pitcher Neftali Feliz was involved in the Mark Teixeira trade), knowing that contenders are nearly always willing to part with those guys to get a deal done. If this trade is going to turn out to be a win for the Rangers, it will almost certainly be because Beltre developed into the star he's capable of becoming.[/quote]

The Yankees must change the attitude of the league when bargaining over trades. And Cashmn is showing that the Yankees will not just concede to get their guy in pinstipes. Cagne cost plenty when you consider that he's a free agent at season's end. He may pitch 25 times for them. Yes, they improved on paper but its about the reality of the team's performance and being in position for all the pieces to fit, muck like Joe T. putting Mariano in games just to get work and keep sharp. Many good things must occur before the Sox's get to Gagne. We shall see.

On another note, Giambi went 1 for 3 against the Sarasota Reds last night. No home run, he said, "no need moving up some of these kids make feel like I'm going against Drysdale." Isn't this comforting but with 8 HR last night there's no urgency.

Trade deadline winners and losers
Ken Rosenthal
[quote]
http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/7080090

Rosenthal's trade roundup
With Eric Gagne joining Jonathan Papelbon, don't expect the Red Sox to blow many late leads, says Ken Rosenthal.
Still, the non-waiver deadline was far from the colossal bore that many predicted, thanks mainly to the Rangers, who traded first baseman Mark Teixeira, closer Eric Gagne and center fielder Kenny Lofton.

Winners

1. Braves

Wow.

They couldn't address their need for a No. 3 starter after the White Sox balked at shortstop Edgar Renteria and Class AA lefty Matt Harrison for right-hander Jon Garland. So, GM John Schuerholz did the next-best thing, upgrading other parts of his club.

The Braves fortified their bullpen by adding Octavio Dotel. (Lisa Blumenfeld / Getty Images)

Not only did Schuerholz acquire Teixeira, who was by far the best hitter on the market, but he also supplemented his bullpen by adding left-hander Ron Mahay in the Teixeria blockbuster and righty Octavio Dotel in a separate trade.

The Braves entered Tuesday's play with the eighth-best record in the National League. No longer are they the eighth-best team. Schuerholz probably will be retired by the time some of the prospects he dealt reach the majors, but so what? He usually trades the right guys.

2. Red Sox

GM Theo Epstein is always relentless, always creative. His acquisition of Gagne — and adept navigation through Gagne's no-trade clause to Boston — could make the Red Sox a World Series favorite. After losing Bobby Abreu to the Yankees last season, the Sox again operated more like — ahem — an uber-team.

Gagne will get the save opportunities that Jonathan Papelbon doesn't and maybe a few more, helping Papelbon stay fresh for the post-season. Epstein failed to find a better right-handed hitting outfielder than outfielder Wily Mo Pena, but that's nitpicking. His proposed acquisition of White Sox right fielder Jermaine Dye seemed excessive from the start.

3. Rangers

First off, owner Tom Hicks needs to shut up.

Hicks can spout off about offering Teixeira about $140 million for eight years, but it was an offer Teixeira was certain to refuse. Everyone in baseball knows that Teixeira's agent, Scott Boras, prefers his clients to determine their values on the open market. Heck, Hicks should know it better than anyone, having signed many a Boras client, including a certain $252-million bauble way back when.

As for the Rangers, their exact plan is unclear, but that's how it always looks when a team begins to reconstruct. GM Jon Daniels collected nine young players for Teixeira, Mahay, Gagne and Lofton. Some are so young, Daniels, 29, might be in his mid-30s by the time they reach the majors.

Stilll, if three or four of the prospects prove to be keepers — and Jarrod Saltalamacchia is pretty close to a sure thing — the trades will be considered a success.

4. Yankees

Yes, the Yankees. If you're going to rip them when they act like rich bullies, then at least give them credit when they show restraint. GM Brian Cashman is wisely hoarding his young pitching, and rookie right-handers Phil Hughes and Joba Chamberlain could be the Yankees' biggest second-half additions.

What's next?
If a player is claimed on waivers after July 31, he can be traded only to the claiming team.

If he clears waivers — as most high-priced veterans normally do — he can be dealt to any club.

A partial list of players who could get moved:

Armando Benitez, RHP, Marlins
Ben Broussard, 1B, Mariners
Shawn Chacon, RHP, Pirates
Jeff Conine, 1B, Reds
Adam Dunn, LF, Reds
Kyle Farnsworth, RHP, Yankees
Livan Hernandez, RHP, Diamondbacks
Troy Glaus, 3B, Blue Jays
Mark Grudzielanek, 2B, Royals
Jason Jennings, RHP, Astros
Byung-Hyun Kim, RHP, Marlins
Ryan Klesko, 1B, Giants
Mike Lamb, IF, Astros
Mark Loretta, IF, Astros
Kevin Millar, 1B, Orioles
Reggie Sanders, OF, Royals
Sammy Sosa, OF, Rangers
Steve Trachsel, RHP, Orioles

Chamberlain, who was drafted only a year ago, is desperately needed to fill a setup role, but the task might not be as daunting as it sounds. The Angels' Francisco Rodriguez, White Sox's Bobby Jenks and Cardinals' Adam Wainwright are recent examples of young relievers who thrived for World Series champions.

5. Dodgers

Like the Yankees, they get points for not doing anything stupid. They made a bold push for A's right-hander Joe Blanton, offering three highly regarded prospects, but in the end settled for right-handed reliever Scott Proctor from the Yankees.

It's difficult to embrace that move after Proctor was Torre-ized (i.e., worn down by excessive use), but it's not as if any of the other NL West contenders made significant improvements.

6. Devil Rays

At least they're trying. GM Andrew Friedman envisions the team fielding a potentially strong rotation next season, so he's hellbent on fortifying his cover-your-eyes bullpen.

Friedman made three trades for relievers, stunning the industry by landing Astros right-hander Dan Wheeler, who was coveted by several contenders.

Maybe none of his deals will work out — relievers are notoriously untrustworthy — but Friedman is just getting started on his bullpen overhaul.

Losers

1. Pirates

The idea of adding veteran right-hander Matt Morris to lead a young rotation isn't ridiculous. But has anyone with the Pirates seen Morris pitch lately?

Over his last eight starts he has allowed almost two hits per inning, his ERA rising from 2.56 to 4.35. Morris, who turns 33 on Aug. 9, is one of the game's great competitors, but his successful opening to the season now looks like an aberration.

No low-revenue team can afford a No. 5 starter earning $9.5 million, and that description could very well fit Morris next season. GM Dave Littlefield just keeps digging himself a bigger hole.

The Nationals had prime trade bait in Chad Cordero, but didn't make a deal. (Greg Fiume / Getty Images)

2. Nationals

Can anyone figure out what the heck they're doing?

While claiming to build for the future, the Nats signed two thirty-something veterans, first baseman Dmitri Young and second baseman Ron Belliard, to two-year extensions. They then failed to trade closer Chad Cordero, setup man Jon Rauch or any other players, irritating rival clubs with their excessive demands.

Cordero, 25, might never have greater trade value; he is eligible for free agency after the '09 season, and given the volatile nature of relievers, likely to decline before then. But hey, the Nationals couldn't move Alfonso Soriano in the middle of a career year, so asking them to move Cordero for say, two decent prospects . . . well, it was just too much.

3. Angels

It's amazing how one of the game's best organizations annually ends up on this list, but the Angels have this annoying habit of targeting one player — Paul Konerko as a free agent after the ‘05 season, Teixeira at this year's deadline — then retreating when their best efforts fail.

In fairness, the Angels had a deal in place for shortstop Miguel Tejada last season before Orioles owner Peter Angelos interceded, and they made a competitive offer for Teixeira. But too often, the Angels point out why deals don't make sense instead of why they do. And unless they make a waiver move in August, they'll again be left with too little around Vladimir Guerrero.

4. Mariners

Maybe this is why the Angels were comfortable standing pat. The Mariners dispatched scouts all over North America to investigate trade possibilities, yet the only player they moved was Class AAA right-hander Julio Mateo, who was charged with assaulting his wife in May.

5. Twins

It's not so much the trade of second baseman Luis Castillo for two minor leaguers, dubious as that move was at a time when the team is still in contention for a postseason berth. GM Terry Ryan, like the Angels' Stoneman, succeeds in part by valuing stability. Still, Ryan should have acted in June to bolster his offense rather than simply wait for Rondell White to return from the disabled list.

6. White Sox

They huffed, and they puffed, and they traded . . . Rob Mackowiak?

The Sox planned on right-hander Jose Contreras being their principal chip, but his poor recent performance and $20 million guaranteed in 2008 and '09 foiled that strategy. GM Ken Williams aimed too high with right fielder Jermaine Dye, and now must offer him arbitration to recoup draft picks.

In-betweens

1. Indians/Tigers

Neither club improved its bullpen, but think about it: Gagne was the only impact reliever who was traded. And, given his history of injuries, even he's not a guarantee.

Dotel, Wheeler, Proctor and Scott Linebrink all have struggled at times this season. The prices for Cordero and others were simply too high.

At least the Tigers added lefty Macay McBride from the Braves for righty Wil Ledezma, who later was designated for assignment and sent to the Padres.

They can acquire another reliever in August if righties Fernando Rodney and/or Joel Zumaya fail to make successful returns from injuries.

The Indians, who added Lofton, are not necessarily finished, either.

2. Padres

Michael Barrett, Milton Bradley, Scott Hairston, Rob Mackowiak, Morgan Ensberg, Shea Hillenbrand on a minor-league contract . . . it all adds up to what, exactly?

Still need bullpen help
Indians
Mariners
Tigers
Yankees
Mets
Phillies
Rockies

Replacing hitting coach Merv Rettenmund with Wally Joyner is yet another low-impact move that would have paled in comparison next to, say, the addition of an Adam Dunn.

3. Phillies

Second baseman Tadahito Iguchi and right-hander Kyle Lohse were reasonable grabs for a team with a thin farm system and injury-depleted roster, but the addition of Mateo is certain to draw criticism in Philadelphia.

The Phillies foolishly allowed right-hander Brett Myers to pitch last season the day after he was arrested for hitting his wife, Kim. Myers took a short leave of absence from the team, and his case was dismissed last October after Kim said that she did not want him prosecuted.

Mateo is Myers II, at least from a public-relations standpoint. Then again, Mateo was 3-1 with a 0.79 ERA, 29 strikeouts and two walks in 34 1/3 innings at Class AAA Tacoma. Any uproar will subside quickly if he pitches well for the Phillies.

4. Astros

The ultimate tweeners, thanks to owner Drayton McLane, who never wants to concede.

McLane's position is semi-understandable, seeing as how he signed left fielder Carlos Lee for $100 million, first baseman Lance Berkman for $85 million and right-hander Roy Oswalt for $73 million.

Still, the Astros needed to do more than just trade reliever Dan Wheeler for third baseman Ty Wigginton and Ensberg to the Padres for a player to be named or cash.

It would have made sense to trade closer Brad Lidge rather than pay him $8 million or more in his final year of arbitration, then potentially lose him as a free agent.

The Astros need to stockpile more young talent, and potential August deals involving players such as right-hander Jason Jennings, infielder Mark Loretta and third baseman Mike Lamb won't bring enough.

5. Reds

Class AA left-hander Matt Maloney was a decent return for Lohse, and the team still might trade Jeff Conine to the Mets in August.

Adam Dunn's contract, though, features one trap door after another, which is one reason he is difficult to deal.

The Reds could not get an adequate return for Dunn because his $13 million club option for next season voids if they move him, reducing him to a two-month rental.

If the Reds exercise the option, Dunn will gain full no-trade protection until June 15. If they decline it, they will receive only draft picks in return.[/quote]

Ken Rosenthal

The Yankees are rich bullies? No, Redsox are The New rich bully in town after getting Gagne and spending Matsuzaka this offseason

Ok. So who are we going to get off waivers for the bull pen......Armando Benitez? If Chamberlain fails then we are definitely doomed!

Seriously, the Red Sox getting Gagne was simply about keeping him away from the Yankees. Their pen already has a 2.7 ERA, Gagne will not improve that so it makes little difference. There is absolutely no way he was worth either Ian Kennedy or Melkey who the Rangers demanded or he "goes to the red sox".

Firstly, i don't see Chamberlain failing, then there is Ramirez who if given a chance might be a lot better than people think if he gets steady work. How many minor leagers EVER have an ERA for the year under 0.6 with almost 2k/inning. Also Chris Britton is a solid arm who should be ready soon (i think he strained a ribcage). I always liked Proctor, even though he came from LA's farm system he always felt like a homegrown Yankee, but to be honest his arm really is about to fall off so here or not he isn't going to hurt/help.

Next... neither the Mariners nor the Indians nor the Tigers did much of anything and all of them are slowing down to a halt.

As for next year... they better resign Posada, Rivera and A-rod because quite frankly they cannot replace any of them although i could see them dealing Damon and Abreau for prospects to get an impact righty (no idea whom...) putting Melkey in right since he definately has the arm for it and signing Torii Hunter for CF.

Chamberlin apparently has the tools to be a very good closer or setup man but needs patience from the organization and fans to mature which in NY canbe near impossible. Fans are already thinking about his failure and the next move. Geez! And he hasn't even thrown one pitch in the majors.

Dan Shaughnessy
Trade wins
Blockbusters have Boston going full speed ahead

By Dan Shaughnessy, Globe Columnist | August 1, 2007

http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/redsox/articles/2007/08/01/trade_wins/

Christmas Day. Graduation Day. Wedding Day. The day you got your first good job. The day you moved into your dream house. The day your first child was born.
Article Tools

And then there's July 31, 2007. The day Boston sports fans were rewarded with a stunning shower of gifts.

OK, there were some days in 2004 when it was pretty cool to be a New England sports enthusiast. And we had a pretty good run of championships in our town back in the golden year of 1986. But it's hard to remember a day like yesterday. After weeks of speculation and hours of rumor and negotiation, the Red Sox became World Series favorites and the Celtics made reservations for the NBA Finals all within a few hours.

Really now, has there ever been a better time to be a Boston sports fan? Is there any city in the country with more fun in store over the next 10 months? And finally, did the Bruins just punch a ticket on the southbound train that dead-ends in Oblivion, USA?

On the third anniversary of deadline deals that delivered Boston its first World Series championship in 86 years, the Sox yesterday acquired Eric Gagne, beating the buzzer by a half-hour and providing manager Terry Francona with a wealth of options in his bullpen. Then the Celtics held a news conference to introduce superstar Kevin Garnett, who is nothing less than one of the best players in the history of the NBA.

Gagne and Garnett. New stars in the New England sports galaxy. New reasons to believe. Rewards for the millions who care so deeply about our local teams.

We know championships are not won on paper. Stocking a roster with All-Pros does not guarantee ring ceremonies (ask the San Diego Chargers). Injuries and old age sometimes get in the way, and not every established star has been able to bring the magic to our region (anyone remember Jack Clark?).

But it's hard to hold back in these early hours after the two trades. Hard not to get carried away.

The Celtics were a joke, a bad product with no hope on the horizon. Twenty-four wins and then the poisonous ping-pong balls took them off the map and solidified ours as a two-team town. The draft-night deal for Ray Allen, by itself, made no sense. But now that Garnett has been brought on board, it turns out there was a plan after all.

The new Celtics look every bit as formidable as any team in the woeful Eastern Conference. They will have to learn to emphasize defense (a big problem last season), but you can surround Paul Pierce, Allen, and Garnett with Rajon Rondo, Kendrick Perkins, or two guys from the John Barry Boys and Girls Club -- they still will make the playoffs. And with three scoring stars, they are as good as or better than Cleveland, Chicago, Detroit, or Miami.

Christmas Day. Graduation Day. Wedding Day. The day you got your first good job. The day you moved into your dream house. The day your first child was born.

And then there's July 31, 2007. The day Boston sports fans were rewarded with a stunning shower of gifts.

OK, there were some days in 2004 when it was pretty cool to be a New England sports enthusiast. And we had a pretty good run of championships in our town back in the golden year of 1986. But it's hard to remember a day like yesterday. After weeks of speculation and hours of rumor and negotiation, the Red Sox became World Series favorites and the Celtics made reservations for the NBA Finals all within a few hours.

Really now, has there ever been a better time to be a Boston sports fan? Is there any city in the country with more fun in store over the next 10 months? And finally, did the Bruins just punch a ticket on the southbound train that dead-ends in Oblivion, USA?

On the third anniversary of deadline deals that delivered Boston its first World Series championship in 86 years, the Sox yesterday acquired Eric Gagne, beating the buzzer by a half-hour and providing manager Terry Francona with a wealth of options in his bullpen. Then the Celtics held a news conference to introduce superstar Kevin Garnett, who is nothing less than one of the best players in the history of the NBA.

Gagne and Garnett. New stars in the New England sports galaxy. New reasons to believe. Rewards for the millions who care so deeply about our local teams.

We know championships are not won on paper. Stocking a roster with All-Pros does not guarantee ring ceremonies (ask the San Diego Chargers). Injuries and old age sometimes get in the way, and not every established star has been able to bring the magic to our region (anyone remember Jack Clark?).

But it's hard to hold back in these early hours after the two trades. Hard not to get carried away.

The Celtics were a joke, a bad product with no hope on the horizon. Twenty-four wins and then the poisonous ping-pong balls took them off the map and solidified ours as a two-team town. The draft-night deal for Ray Allen, by itself, made no sense. But now that Garnett has been brought on board, it turns out there was a plan after all.

The new Celtics look every bit as formidable as any team in the woeful Eastern Conference. They will have to learn to emphasize defense (a big problem last season), but you can surround Paul Pierce, Allen, and Garnett with Rajon Rondo, Kendrick Perkins, or two guys from the John Barry Boys and Girls Club -- they still will make the playoffs. And with three scoring stars, they are as good as or better than Cleveland, Chicago, Detroit, or Miami.
Page 2 of 2 --

The Celtics have junked the future in exchange for the present. It's right out of the George Allen "Future is Now" playbook. And it makes us eager to get back to the Garden for the first time in a long time.
Article Tools

Garnett is a legitimate NBA force. There never has been anyone quite like him. He's a 6-foot-11-inch, backboard-eating, perimeter-roaming, jump-shooting former Most Valuable Player. And his arrival gives the Celtics a shot to make one of those turnarounds that accompanied Larry Bird's first year in Boston (29 wins to 61 wins).

I am reminded of Danny Ainge's early days with the Celtics. Red Auerbach saw Ainge playing a little poker with Kevin McHale and some other teammates and asked Ainge if gambling was a violation of his Mormon faith.

"It's not gambling when I play against these guys," Ainge said with a smile. "It's a sure thing."

Certainly, Al Jefferson may become an All-Star and Gerald Green someday may harness his gifts and better learn the game, but in the short term, this deal is no gamble. And kudos to the sometimes maligned Celtics owners. They have put their wallets on the line to bring a winner back to Boston.

Which brings us to the Sox. Remember when the Yankees stockpiled stars and contracts like the Cold War Soviet Union stacking nuclear missiles? The Sox have become the Yankees and John Henry is playing the part of George Steinbrenner with more believability (if less bluster) than Oliver Platt.

A team that already has Jonathan Papelbon, Hideki Okajima, and Mike Timlin adds Eric Gagne? The Sox' stable of starters now is backed by a raft of reliable relievers. The Sox have the best record in baseball and are getting ready to add Gagne and get Curt Schilling back. In one swift trade-deadline motion, the Sox made themselves October favorites. Meanwhile, the Yankees dozed. (Scott Proctor to the Dodgers for third baseman Wilson Betemit barely registers.)

Roll the tape back a little more to truly appreciate what is happening around here. The Patriots came within a minute of advancing to the Super Bowl, then reloaded with ferocity never seen before during the Bill Belichick regime. You know their names. And now the Patriots are favorites to make it to Arizona in February.

We are the town with Manny Ramírez, Tom Brady, Kevin Garnett, Daisuke Matsuzaka, Randy Moss, Ray Allen, Curt Schilling, Bill Belichick, Paul Pierce, David Ortiz, Adalius Thomas, Jonathan Papelbon, Tedy Bruschi, Josh Beckett, Rodney Harrison, Jason Varitek, Richard Seymour, and Eric Gagne. We have reasonable expectations of a World Series, a Super Bowl, and the NBA Finals. There never has been a better time to be a sports fan in Boston.

Dan Shaughnessy is a Globe columnist. He can be reached at dshaughnessy@globe.com.

Boston Sport Teams owned Ny? :lol:

Its always good to plan a few steps ahead, but yea i think people need to chill. Hopefully we can take the wildcard lead in the next week or two and then people will be a lot happier...

In addition to my comment of 9:35 AM, What if Jeter was booed out of NY in his first year. He had a boatload of errors.

Larry M.:

I agree with you on changing the attitude of the league. At trade deadline time, there are always two prices for players on the market: the going price and "the Yankee price." Other teams always demand more from the Yankees. The Red Sox gave up a laughable amount for Gagne.

(Still, Ian Kennedy and a bush-leaguer to be named later for Gagne would have saved the bullpen.)

And my thoughts on Rivera:

If he does to the Yankees what other teams do (demand a market price for other teams bidding for his services, but a higher, "Yankee price" for the Yankees to keep him) I say "Thanks for the Memories and good luck with the Astros."

Nobody has saved more important games for their team than Mariano Rivera. But nobody has blown more big games for their team than Mariano Rivera. To this day I think it was lame for him to blame Brosius for losing the 2001 World Series. He was thisclose to putting down the Red Sox in 2004, but couldn't nail it down. Sandy Alomar's home run in 1997 is still in orbit.

The Yankees haven't won since 2000. Mariano needs a dose of reality.

I am very surprised by the amount of people furious about trading Proctor. Here is why I think it is a good trade:

1. Proctor was already losing favor with Torre- Vizciano and Villone were already being used in games where the Yankees were winning. For the most part, Proctor was being used in games that the Yankees were trailing-look it up.

2. Betamit dooes not have to play anywhere. The Yankees' bench has been terrible all year- they had a few extra inning games when they didn't use one bench palyer. Now with Betamit and Molina, thye have major leaguers on the bench. Can you imagine if Cano, Jeter or Rodriguez had gotten injured in May or June. Now they have insurance for this. A team with this high a payroll should have major league quality reserves. Betamit has also been great as a pinch hitter this year.

As far as Gagne:

1. According to the stories in the press today, texas used the Yankees. They told Cashman we want either Kennedy or Cabrera or he is going to Bosoton. that's blackmail. Cashman did the right thing by not doing this. Who would play centerfield if Cabrera were traded? Damon?

2. The Yankees' starting pitching has not shown any indication that it is consistent enough to go late into games and, more importantly to hold leads in the middle of games. This is why Rivera has not gotten alot of work this yar. Most of their wins are blowouts, and Torre doesn't pitch his main bullpen guys when the Yankees are trailing. Therefore, there could be long streetches where Gagne would not be used especially if the "Three sub-.500 aces" of Mussina. Clemens and Pettitte continue their inconsistency. The yankees rested Rivera the entire month of September last year to get him redy for the playoffs. What happened? Mussina, Johnson and Wright flopped, and Rivera just sat there.

You can't trade your starting centerfielder or top prospect for a set up guy who might not be used in the majority of your games. If texas was giving hom away, I would take him, but not for the terms offered.

finally the deadline has passed. cash didn't trade away for any of the young guys, who in turn could prove worthy or not.

however, yanks can benefit from having a healthy hughes and giambi come back.

also, not trading anyone away in blockbuster deals or depleteing the farm system sends a positve vibe throughout the clubhouse. cash essentially said - this is the team we are going to win with.

and why not? u got your a-rod, your jeter, a locked in matsui, the youth movement in cano, melky and phillips. your starting pitching, as long as they stay healthy, consists of a proven pett, clemens and moose. you know what you get from wang...and hughes is more than ready to follow the older boys right along.

abreu is on when patient and stay on the ball. with giambi, we need him to not try and hit 5-r homers, but to get on base and work pitchers. damon needs to do the same...get on base and have jetes move him over.

this is the team we will win with. not a question if CLE or SEA or LAA can stay afloat, its more of a question if our 200 mill. ball players can play like the yanks we saw last night!

Melky, or Kennedy for 2 months of Gagne not worth mentioning. For once, Cashman did the right thing. Now need to pass Farns "not"Worth through waivers and trade him to Atlanta for Wickman. Kay backed off a little, with Girardi and Leiter doing a great job in the booth last night. Kay "mouth" must remember, less Kay is more Kay.
PS - Kay is still a JINX!

Mike,

I totally agree about Gagne, but if that is the case how come Boston got him for practically nothing?

Looking at the runs scored runs given up for yankees and red sox is pretty interesting. We've scored a ton more, but they've given up fewer runs. I feel like potential success from hughes and chamberlain and the fact many of those runs came at our lowest point indicate that we are playing better overall baseball than is boston. Getting Giambi back can't hurt either.

finally, what is the story with jason jennings? wasn't he reasonably well regarded a year or two back?

With 16 young pitchers and all this money this is the best Cashman can do?

Kept Farnworth = loss

Kept Igawa = major loss

Losing Proctor = loss

We could have had Wiggy or anyone for the utility position.

We lost a great guy, durable (though wild) who throws 95 miles per hour and is never afraid to take the ball and could handle NYC for a scrub.

We will probably make the playoffs and then Detroit and Boston will annihilate us. Cleveland and Seattle will fade as someone else noted.

Sickening really to pick up the paper this morning and see the Red Sox got Gagne for Gabbard. We would have topped that offer easily without selling off the farm system.

How many pitching prospects do you need?

We beat up on CWS, Tampa, KC, but when push comes to shove we may not have it when you have to pitch ...

Igawa
Mussina (iffy at best)
Farns

I hate to be negative, I just expected so much more.

Maybe it will all work out. And maybe there were things behind the scenes preventing a deal that we don't know about. Let's face it, we have an old team on the field, very prone to injury with horrendous character problems (we've addressed this many times) and horrible contracts. The guys we need to lock up are not signed. That's also a problem. And NY is a terror target haven, what player would want to be there when the next shoe drops? (I hope nothing happens but it should concern us all considering the "gut feelings" of our "elites.")

But the Red Sox and Braves will probably meet in the World Series now. If I were the Mets I'd be worried.

(But they have Glavine to pinch hit.)

Go Yankees!

Any real man, any real Yankee fan and any real American should be outraged at the idea of a ML game being played in China. This considering the evil leadership in Beijing's Politburo. People should write to Bud Selig and demand he stop this disgusting feting of the animals who brought you Tiananmen Square and have openly threatened us with nuclear war over Taiwan.

For even proposing this Bud Selig and the other "leaders" of ML Baseball should be send to a Chinese slave labor laogai gulag.

It's disgusting.

What the hell is wrong with people?

Yanks have won the past 2 series they played vs Boston and look out, it will happen again down the road. Good job Cashman for keeping the young kids instead of blowing it on a Tommy John oft injured Gagne who the Yanks can hit!

I meant "sent to a camp ..."

Sorry for the typo.

And any MLB player who goes to China to play should be banned from all MLB games forever.

If Chamberlain is the answer to the bullpen how come he hasn't been called up yet?

Because he had never pitched in relief before monday.

He struck out the side monday.

I think they may give him another inning or two in AAA before bringing him up.

to be honest, i think the biggest blunder this year was the psychological treatment of igawa. sending him down to the lowest levels of the minors is damaging especially when he is trying to learn the ropes in the u.s. and there were never any human interest stories about matsui bringing him along etc. (even if that isnt how they do it in japan).

My point is that one espn blogger noted that he might over think his starts and would be good out of the bullpen because of his high k rate. but that ship has sailed since he has been moved around and hated on so much.

oh well. he is still young and has many years to keep trying or scaring us. one or the other.

Buster,

I am sorry nut I disagree about Igawa. He walks way to many people for the bull pen. We already have that now. Why would we want more?

Nice softball game last night...I hope the boys saved some for tonight.

Buster,

That was supposed to be "I am sorry but" not nut.

I am now hearing "be patient" when it comes to Chamberlain and his probable "bullpen" morph. This is Aug. The time for patience is Spring Training, April, May, June. We coulda had Gagne for our "3rd" best minor league pitcher, and received 2 draft picks if he "walked" at seasons end. Basically, Gagne and 2 draft picks, for our 3rd best minor league pitcher and probably some minor league "trash". Throw in the fact that Gagne went to the team we will have to defeat in order to reach the World Series, and making this trade was imperative. Cashman continues to show he cannot "pull the trigger" on trades involving major league "big name" players. He has shown he will not hesitate to throw money at mediocre players, yet "freezes" when it comes to trading actual players, whether they be major or minor leaguers. I keep hearing how the Yanks have "stocked" their minor league system to the "gills", yet they can't spare their 3rd best minor league pitcher to fortify a "leaking" bullpen with a proven Saver? Ridiculous. Cashman needs to follow that Steinbrenner dictum, "Either lead, follow, or get the hell out of the way". Currently, Cashman and the Yanks are "treading" water. Clearly, this is not the way to get by the R\Sox and advance to the World Series.

Mike,
Indeed walks spell doom (listen to any Jon Sterling analysis in late innings), but then again, Igawa's best game came when Karstens got injured. Second, he might benefit from the opposing team only seeing him once through the order.

tough to say, but my point was mainly that we wont know this year because he is likely a mess mechanically and psychologically after all this shuffling.

just thought that with bp work you also deny him the ability to do that stupid pre-game workout.

Roy-

if you consider winning 16-3, 8 HRs and gaining a game on both teams ahead of us in both division and WC as "treading water", i'll certainly take it.

just despite you and your constant "sell the farm" trade deals, im estatic the yanks didnt trade for anyone you constantly mentioned.

would gagne help the yanks. sure, no doubt. but for what they were asking? not so much. however, i would have loved to seen your posts if we did make the deal, and gagne blows his oft-injured, yet "major league" elbow in the middle of a playoff hunt.

its good to see your posts though Roy. it brings the rest of us back down to reality and distingushes fans like you that live in a fantasy world.

Roy,

Do you really think it would be a good idea to bring up Joba into relief without even giving him a few chances in AAA to see what it is like to pitch in relief?

You make Gange out to be this amazing big name player. He is 31, injury prone and does not have the stuff he had when he was getting 50+ saves. To trade away a top prospect for 2 months of Gange is idiotic and goes against what Cashman has been trying to do the past few years.

Teams do not give away star pitchers anymore. They almost always have to come from within your organization. We need every high end pitching prospect we can get in order to move forward in the post Clemens, Mussina, Pettitte years.

We have a lot of options from within for the bullpen....Karstens, Joba, Edwar, Ohlendorf, Colter Bean....the list goes on

Being a GM is simple ...

A.

You get the best players.

B.

And you keep the best players away from your chief rivals.

The Mets and Yankees have both failed miserably in the recent trade a thon.

The goal is to win the World Series.

There is NO CHANCE of that in 2007 for either team.

THe Best Players went to the "Devil" Redsox?

Like Matsuzaka, Gagne...

in looking ahead, im going to save a lot of you the trouble of reading Roy's posts next year at the deadline.

a glimpse of what he will say-

go "after" santana and nathan from the "twins". here is a "block"buster-

santana and nathan "for" hughes, chamberlin, "jeter", cano and duncan.

"yankees" would be stupid "not" to do it.

hahahaha

Another thing....

The Red Sox already had one of the best bullpens in the league.

Yes, Gange obviously helps them even more.

But there is a big picture involved in all of this. You have to look past this season when making moves like that.

Trading Proctor who has already pitched a lot this year and was already showing signs of fatigue for an upgrade on our bench was a great move.

The only beef I have is that they did not get rid of Farnsworth.

Once again, Roy shows us his “misguided” wisdom on the Gagne non-trade.

First off, Gagne is NOT a “proven” player as he used to be. He is an injury-plagued walking rehab center who can’t stay healthy to save his life. He hasn’t pitched all full season since 2004 and has already spent time on the DL earlier this season.

It was too big of a risk to acquire a rental for two months and give away one of their top pitching prospects that is near major-league ready. Kennedy will likely be in the starting games for the Yankees at some point as early as 2008.

Kennedy probably wouldn’t be in the rotation coming out of Spring Training because there wouldn’t be room for him with the #4 and #5 slot occupied by Hughes and Chamberlain. However, an injury or a struggling starter could happen at any time -- as we’ve seen the last few seasons out of Yankee starters, and Kennedy could very well get his shot.

Yeah, they could have gotten draft picks when Gagne walks after this season (which he certainly would have done), but I’ll take a guy who has already flourished through their minor league system and is almost major-league ready than a “what if” draft pick that won’t be chosen for another year.

Most everyone, including guys like Rosenthal, Buster Olney, and even Peter Gammons thought it was the smart move for Cashman to keep the young kids. My guess is that most Yankee fans feel the same way.

I guess since the deadline is over and Roy can’t keep harping on getting Teixeira, he now has to harp about not getting Gagne for the next two months.

Keep on talking, Roy. Not many are listening to you.

Brian Cashman with the blessing of the front office has decided to stand pat except for an improvement on the bench. Many fans are disappointed with this present decision. Believing it makes the pennant unobtainable with the present bullpen staff. Athletes are funny animals. They all have the necessary skills to suceed or achieve at their game but most of the time a mental aspect will interfere with the physical. All the trades to bring the physical athlete to the team can be made but no guarantee of success. If our Yankee bullpen the guys who throw 95+ or there abouts pitch with some confidence than All the Gagne's in the league will not stop this team from playing in the WS.

The team offensively and defensively have hit their stride. Now for some confident pitching much like Viscaino is doing whom I have asked to be traded for one dirty water hot dog with sauerkraut.

Stack the Yankee team against the R\Sox or Tigers in Oct. and what have you got? Another quick exit, and a long winter. Oh yea, we also still have Kennedy. WOW

With "Homer" Gammons weighing in and backing Cashman's "standing pat", I now rest my case.

Roy you are exactly right.

The trade and non trades are a disaster.

But Cashman has a list an arm long of horrible deals.

Well, guess what?

The best teams on paper don't always win.

If that was the case, we wouldn't have wildcard teams like the Marlins, Angels, Cardinals, and the Red Sox of 2004 winning the World Series.

It's not about having the best team on paper. It's about playing the best ball in October.

We have about 20 prospects now that I count them.

We need Gagne, now.

And he's not only not with us, he's with freakin' Boston.

Viper this is a no brainer. Just to keep him AWAY from Boston would have been a victory.

We have not won the World Series in 7 years or so.

In 03 we were mauled by Florida and if AJ Burnett wasn't hurt we'd have been swept probably.

Kennedy is good. But how much better than Horne or Brackman or any of the other 17 kids we have?

I think Roy is right.

Thought Nullification of Roy's points are not fair.

We'll make the playoffs and get wiped out. Big deal, it happens every year now.

Just my two cents.

With "Homer" Gammons weighing in and backing Cashman's "standing pat", I now rest my case.
==============================

You forgot the other two guys I mentioned -- Olney and Rosenthal.

I guess those guys are "Red Sox homers" too, huh?

Olney wrote an outstanding book about the Yanks a few years ago and used to cover them a few years ago for the Times.

If anything, Olney is more of a Yankee homer.

You sound foolish, Roy. Give it up.

Roy, you forget... Cashman made sure The Farns was untouchable. Utterly brilliant. And with Joe DiMaggio Betemit, the pennant is ours.

Oops. The last post was mine.

Why are you guys worried about the Red Sox?

The Yanks probably weren't going to win the AL East whether they got Gagne or not.

The Yanks should be focusing on the wildcard to get to the post-season.

I wouldn't worry about the Red Sox in the postseason because the Tigers are going to beat them anyways.

Baseball Prospectus Redsox are Overwhelming Underdogs?
When to Panic in Boston

[quote][url=http://baseballprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=6531]http://baseballprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=6531[/url]

by John Perrotto

It's difficult to consider a team with a $143-million payroll and seemingly limitless resources as an underdog. However, Red Sox designated hitter David Ortiz insists his team is always the underdog in the American League East. And how can you argue with the genial Big Papi anyway?

“Everybody in America picked the Yankees to win the division this year,” Ortiz said. “We’re the team that wasn’t supposed to win. We know we have a good team, though. I know a lot of people are still picking the Yankees to win. We’ll play the games and see what happens.”

It's certainly hard to portray the Red Sox as underdogs now that they have the best record in the major leagues (64-42) and hold a seven-game lead over the Yankees in the AL East. However, there are a few reasons why the Red Sox and their fans are worried. There is always that inferiority complex when it comes to the Yankees, as New York has won the last nine division titles--though the Red Sox last won a World Series in 2004, while the Yankees haven’t won it all since 2000. Furthermore, the Yankees have cut into what once seemed like an insurmountable division lead. The Red Sox’ lead was in double digits by May 20 and got as high 12 games on July 5.

Manager Terry Francona smiled and recalled something he was told in his first year as manager in Boston in 2004. “If you’re not in a panic then it’s time to move from East Coast to the Midwest,” Francona said. Francona understands if there is a bit of anxiety about the Yankees making a charge, but he isn’t surprised. “You knew there was no way that they were going to play poorly all year, that wasn’t going to happen,” Francona said. “There is too much talent on that team and Joe Torre is too good of a manager for that to happen. That’s why I’ve never gotten too excited, regardless of how big our lead got.
[/quote]

I just threw up After reading this garbage. Baseball Prospectus John Perrotto made a good point that Redsox are no longer consider Underdogs to the Yankees after acquiring Gagne yesterday and Dice-k , Nancy Drew and Lugo in the offseason.

as much as i hate him, gammons is the hall of fame caliber baseball analyst, along with other above avaerage guys like rosenthal and olney (yankee haters or not)....not you Roy.

as a matter of fact, the only "homer" out of all the names mentioned is ...you!

Wow..."Roy" is taking a "beating" today. I shared your "disappointment" yesterday Roy, but "after" some reading "up" on what "The Rangers" wanted for "Gagne", I think "Cash" made the "right" call.
With Karstens, Rasner, Chamberlain, Ramirez and Hughes all coming up or back, there will be plenty of "arms" to stick in "The Pen".
I don't "think" the Yanks should have traded "Melky" and "Kennedy" for "Gagne" so I'm "glad" it didn't "happen".

It did hurt to see Gagne go to Boston though, but he is a rental player whom the Sox gave up quite a bit for if you ask me, but I don't blame them, they have the team to beat right now so they may as well go for it. One reliever was not going to save the Yanks season.

Viper, Chip has tried diligently to educate Roy, he's not interested. He still thinks salvation can be found trading away prospects for other teams trash (anyone ask why Texas got rid of Gagne for nothing? Maybe they know something?). He doesn't care that it didn't work in the 80's for the Yanks or 02-07, he continues to plod along in a trance uttering mindlessly what he's been programed to believe. That other sheep are willing to follow him over the cliff is not surprising.

Does anyone else wonder why Texas wasn't able to get more for Gagne, given the high market for relief pitchers? Cleveland, Atlanta, Tampa Bay, Boston, the Yankees, San Diego, Arizona, NY Mets all were looking to upgrade their pen, and the best the Rangers could do is Gabbard and some 19 YOA prospect? This is the guy that we should have given up possibly our most polished minor league pitching prospect for, as if the Yankess are one set-up guy with a ruber band for an elbow tendon away from a world series ring?

Roy and others, keep spouting your nonsense about trading away the farm for veteran rentals in their thirties hoping for a quick fix. Most on this board realize just how foolish you guys are...

Couldn't agree more, michaelz.

I agree with you too Jim...

After all was said and done, keeping all our guys was the best decision.

If we do take the wildcard, it will be nice to see how our Yankees react to being underdogs. Sometimes situation like these makes our team play harder and smarter than the favorites.

These next few years are going to be exciting for the yankees and there fans. Looking forward to see our young guys play!

I agree. This will be the first time the Yanks are considered underdogs. I think it will put a fire in their bellies that they have not had over the past 3-7 years. They will play harder to show who they really are!

Ed Price in today's Star-Ledger quotes a scout on Betemit:

"nonchalant on defense....an overswinger at the plate....a very weird guy, a lazy guy."

That should add to clubhouse chemistry. Maybe F-Worth needs a roomie.

Zander, I too find it hard to believe we couldn't get more for Proctor than Betemit. For some reason, the Yanks wanted this guy bad, and I don't know why. He does play many positions, has a little pop, and actually has good pinch hitting numbers. My guess is that the Yanks would have preferred Wigginton but couldn't get that deal done because the teams were in the same division. Who knows, Proctor could blow out his arm shortly and we'll all be glad that we got something, even if it's not exactly what we wanted...

In the case of the Gagne trade, no trade was the better trade. I am not giving up future pitching prospects for 3 months of some guy who' arm could fall off any minute.

I was pissed off that we traded Proctor and kept Farnsworth. I was not upset that we didn't get Gagne as in my opinion, the price for him was just too high. As someone said, the Rangers were trying to rip us off by asking for melky and/or Kennedy. What they got from Boston was a "song and a dance" and the Red Sox couldn't refuse to make that deal.
We could and I'm glad that we did. (Sorry Roy).
For the past 6 years or so, we've been killing Cashman for trading away our young guys. Now that he refuses to do that, we're killing him again.
Make up your minds!
There's help on the way for us. Hughes will be back this weekend, Chamberlain isn't far away and I believe that we're going to be really happy with him, and Giambi will be back (and healthy hopefully) which should add a significant threat to the order.
Now if A-Rod can hit that DAMN 500th, he's going on a tear!

If I remember correctly, Betemit disappeared on the Dodgers either in Spring Training or early in the season due to some personal issues so he got off to a really bad start with them.
I don't understand the infatuation Cashman has had with him but I have to be honest I like the idea of a pinch hitter actually having a chance at hitting a dinger now and then as opposed to our all-star bench of Nieves and Cairo from earlier this season.

Now we have Betemit and the third best Molina brother (or fourth best, depending on who you ask- Mr. or Mrs. Molina).
Soon Giambi will be back and Duncan has shown good power so the lineup is taking shape.
If I'm the Yanks now I just keep throwing different guys in the pen and see who takes the bull by the horns.

For the past 6 years or so, we've been killing Cashman for trading away our young guys. Now that he refuses to do that, we're killing him again.

Make up your minds!

=============================

Exactly, John.

Some people just complain for the sheer joy of complaining.

Zander: Betemit will here from the 54K coaches in the stands if he overswings and nonchalants in the field. This is a given.

Correction: hear

John, I think all of us would like to have seen Farnsworth go instead of Proctor. However, worthless simply has no value at this point. Add him to the list of bad contracts we are stuck with at this point.

One other thing:

We've been killing Matsui (myself included as I named him Gecko-sui), but...
13 homeruns this month!

WOW!

This is the year that we go all the way again. This team has that "thing" that the Yanks of old had. They didn't have it untill recently but it is finally here. You all will be priaoing the Dog when we win another WS!

MZ,

As I've said it before ad nauseum, I just don't get Farnsworth! He's got amazing stuff. He throws 98-100mph fastballs, has a wicked slider, but he can't throw strikes and get ahead of hitters.
He's a headcase pure and simple.
Who can straighten this guy out? SOMEONE has got to get through to this guy!
If he can get his act together, we'd all be saying, "Proctor? Who's that?".
He needs to grow up, stop pouting and do his stinkin' job!!!
I wish that I had his talent!

Viper,

We have to stay the course. I believe that you have been saying that all year, along with Jim A.

Rangers used the Yanks to "up the ante" for Gagne and we didn't bite. Kennedy is a legitimate No.3 starter (replacing Mussina?)and will be in the rotation along with Hughes, Chamberlain. We may lose 3 starters next year (Clemens,Pettite,Mussina?)and will need to fortify our rotation.The bullpen will be fine with Villone,Vizcaino, and "Joba" for now (Jose Veras will be back soon too). I believe we will catch Boston by the first week of September. Red Sox will be the wild card. Write that down!

Man, whatever magic Ozzie coaxed out of Contreras is now officially gone.

You people are being completely shortsighted and frankly disrespectful to Roy.

He didn't do himself any favors with the constant hysterical pining for Mark Teixera but it doesn't mean he's not absolutely on the money on this Gagne deal.

Viper et al...

YOu people are acting like all we have to do this year is make the post season..Fine. I'm all for it but what happens when we get there?

Eventually we'll have to play the Redsox and I hope we can put down a 6 or 8 spot in the first 6 innings cause I got news for you the Redsox are gonna be LIGHTS OUT in the 7th 8th and 9th.
I hope to god that Hughes and Chamberlain will provide the kind of reliable performance we'll need this season but they are still rookies and at times will perform like such.

Gagne was not without risk but when you have a bullpen that even MARIANO RIVERA SAIS NEEDS HELP YOU TAKE A RISK!!

It's not fair that Texas wanted more from us than Boston I agree but you forget we still have the biggest payroll in baseball and loosing Kennedy for Gagne and a fighting chance this year IMO would've been a no-brainer. We could always go buy somebody next season as I'm sure we will and would have anyway.

I like keeping our young arms for the future but where do you draw the line between future and present?

When Mariano opens his mouth if I'm the GM I listen.

I hope this kid can follow the K-Rods and Papelbons and bail us out but the fact remains...
When and if we do meet Boston they will have essentially shortened those games to 6 innings and that's ASSSUMING that thier starters who ARE SUPERIOR!!! than ours have been knocked out before then.

I'm a Yankee fan first and a Cashman must die lobbyist 2nd. So I'll remain optimistic and devoted to both.

PS. Go easy on "Roy"

Mike from Jersey,

Where in NJ are you from? I use to live in Sayreville in Middlesex County. Anyway...

IF we can get the lead down to no worse than 5 before we play them at the end of the month then we have a shot.
But it's only a shot. We need to be perfect against them meaning taking 2-3 isn't going to cut it.
We have no wiggle room.
The wildcard is more realistic and maybe a "change of scenery" will do us good for a change.
We won the division the past 2 years (actually, the past 12) and we have what to show for it?
Bounced in the first round in 2005 by the "Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim".
Bounced in 2006 by Detroit.
Maybe the wildcard is the ticket to the dance.

Mike from Jersey, I am writing it down.

If the Yankees can make up 7 games in 4 1/2 weeks (let alone two months) I will buy a Yankee hat and wear it in public for a whole day

How's about that?

Let's take a look at this for a second:
2002 - The "Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim" won the wildcard. Result: won the series.
The SF Giants won the wildcard that same season. Result: made it to the series.
2003 - The Florida marlins won the wildcard. result: won the series.
2004 - We all know THAT ONE.
2005 - The Astros won the wildcard. Result: made it to the series.
2006 - The Tigers won the wildcard. Result: made it to the series.

There's hope just yet.

Phucker,
"Cashman must die" lobbyist?
I thought that my guillotine comments and sepaku comments were rough!
LOL.

Look. We have to concentrate on winning above all. If that ends with us winning the division (unlikely) then that would be great. It would be a very bad thing for the Yankees to look at other teams. All they need to do is look at themselves and win. Yes we have holes here and their but so do all the other teams that we are chasing. If they didn't they would be 25 games in front of us (especially after our horrendous start) and everybody else. Just win baby!

Sully,

If that happens, I want you to take a picture in the Yankee hat and post it where we can all see it.

The Yanks don't have to make up 7 1/2 in 4 weeks.

They have to get it to 5 by the 28th.

If they do, then, as I said, they have a shot.
Not a gaurantee, a shot.

You guys have the upper hand and room for error.
We don't.

John G

I reserve the right to change lobbies pending the succesful transition of one "JOB UH" from minor league ACE to 8th inning MLB Rivera handoff boy.

If I wasn't so utterly thrilled that our boy comes back Saturday I would've been really bummed out today.

I can't wait to watch the Baby ROcket again.

PS...HOW BAD ARE THE WHITESOX!!!

HOW GOOD ARE THE ORIOLES!!!

WHO DO THE ORIOLES THINK THEY ARE!!!

Hey where's Nudge today. I though he would be in his glory today. He could bash the Yankees for not getting Gagne and praise the Sox for getting him.

How F%&ked are THE METS!!

Braves got Tex and Dotel LMAO!!!

The toughest thing to do in baseball is rebuild and make the post-season at the same time.

Injecting youth into this team and keeping the young guns to eventually take over in the rotation is the way to go.

It's all about pitching -- and defense.

The Yanks need to keep and develop their young pitchers and patch holes in the lineup with solid bats and guys who can play defense.

It is the reason why the Yanks won during the 90s when they didn't have All-Stars at every position or guys who hit 30 homeruns every year. They won because they had quality arms on the mound every night -- which was a huge advantage every other team.

It's much easier to find or buy good position players than it is to buy good major league pitchers -- especially starters.

Cashman is doing the right thing.

I can’t understand why some of you don't see it.

Phucker,

I loved the comment.

Yes, you do have the right to change lobbys.

We know where your heart is.

You bleed pistripes like MOST of us here.

Sully bleeds clam chowdah!

Viper,
In any market besides NY and Boston, Cashman would be praised like mad for doing what he is doing- Taking an aging team and rebuilding it slowly, all while still winning the division and making the playoffs every year.

I will say this though, the Yanks can't be satisfied with just getting to the playoffs and with the team the way it is right now, they will repeat their lack of playoff success from the past couple of years. However, they have so many good things that can happen to them (Hughes back; Karsten, Rasner, Mentk back; Chamberlain and Ramirez up) that it is entirely possible ALL of their problems can be fixed from within (probably except the lack of RH power from someone other than A-Rod, even then, Betemit can help although he is supposedly much better from the left side).

I've never been one to say the Yanks need to save money, hell, they have tons of it and we all contribute to it by buying expensive tickets, jerseys, hats etc. so why not spend it? The thing is they need to spend better than they have in the past and Cashman, in my opinion is trying to do that. Instead of buying a 35 yr old injury prone former all star, he is now looking at solid younger players with the right tools before spending the money.

Let's not forget folks that tons of kids grow up dreaming of playing for the Yankees and that doesn't change when you get to MLB. I always hear former players saying they wished they could've played for the Yanks at some time or other. This may be especially true of players from foreign countries who only hear about the Yankees and how great they are so let's bring on Santana when he's ready, but don't wait until he's 35, I know he wants to play for them, I can feel it! Hell, I'm 40 and I still dream about playing CF at Yankee Stadium all the time!

Michael,

do you really think the whole season would have turned on acquiring Gagne? Honestly?

What if:

1) he blew out his arm (again);
2) Joba comes up and gives us 80% of Gagne or more;
3) Hughes comes up and dominates;
4) Hughes comes up and flops;
5) Mussina pitches lights out (real unlikely);
6) Giambi comes back and goes on a tear;
7) Damon, Melky, and Cano remain relatively hot the rest of the way;
8) Seattle and Cleveland continue to play poorly;
9) Boston struggles because their notorious 2nd half slumpers do just that'

I could go on and on. I refuse to believe that so much turns on the acquistion (or failue to acquire) one set-up guy with arm problems. Sorry, just don't see it....

Good point Micahelz!

Let's not forget Gagne has a very bad back and October's in New England and NY aren't exactly warm like LA and Texas.
To me, there's just as big an "If" w/ Gagne as there is with Chamberlain:
If Gagne can stay healthy and adjusts to the 8th inning
If Chamberlain is truly ready and can handle the bullpen role

One IF just cost a whole heck of a lot less than the other so I'm willing to ride it out and see what happens.

Roy, contrary to what Viper said, I am definitely listening to you.

But only because I'm amazed at how much of a jacknut you could be! Please, please, Roy, many of us are begging you...kindly remove your "head" from your "a$$".

Look, if the Yankees meet the Red Sox in the playoffs, it will have to be in the second round. and if they make it to the second round, they will be playing good enough ball at the time to beat whomever they play. And if their offense is clicking well enough to beat the Angels or Tigers pitching, they will absolutely be able to beat the Red Sox. The Yankees have been able to hit - hard - Matsuzaka, Schilling, and Beckett. The one guy I'm worried about is gabbard. Oh wait...he's not in Boston anymore!

Speaking of Santana

The Minnesota Twins didn't add any players but did subtract their starting second baseman at the trade deadline. And after watching his front office's inactivity, ace Johan Santana reportedly didn't hide his disappointment.

"It's not just about hope," Santana told The Star Tribune. "In a realistic world, you have to really make it happen and go for it.

"You always talk about future, future. ... But if you only worry about the future, then I guess a lot of us won't be part of it," Santana told the newspaper.

Santana can be a free agent after the 2008 season. The only move Minnesota made before the non-waiver trade deadline was to send second baseman Luis Castillo to the New York Mets for two minor league prospects.

"Why waste time when you're talking about something that's always going to be like that? It's never going to be beyond this point," Santana told the newspaper. "It doesn't make any sense for me to be here, you know?"

John G,

Did you get the name of that book about the great pitchers of all time? did you get I Stil Love Joni James yet?

If Gagne starts off well-- the first time Papelbon blows a save- the calls will begin to replace him with Gagne, and then what happens to the chemistry?

Also- if the Red Sox loved this guy so much why didn't they sign him as a free agent when no one wanted him and move Papelbon to the rotation? They were willing to do this for Joel Piniero, so why not for Gagne?

The quotes from Santana should make all Yankee fans feel better about not trading prospects yesterday. The Twins will put him out to bid next summer before losing him and a Cabrera/Kenendy/Horne package is a good place to start.

Jim,

I don’t think guys like Jeter, A-Rod, Mo, and Posada are satisfied with just playoff appearances.

But, I think they also realize that they will be fine if they play their game because they are more than capable of beating any other team.

Most fans of this team don’t appreciate the fact that the success this team has had since 1995 is unparalleled by any other major league team.

It’s extremely difficult to rebuild the rotation in such a short amount of time with young guns and the Yanks are on the verge of doing just that -- and compete for the post-season at the same time.

Atlanta has been good at doing it. Boston couldn’t do it. Detroit was terrible for almost 20 years. MIN had a lot of down years before their recent run of good ones.

OAK has been very good in recent years with their young pitching, but they haven't been to the World Series under Billy Beane.

The list goes on and on.

We don’t know what this team is going to do the rest of the season.

But, I’ll say this much -- their rotation is being built in such a way where they can be dominant for a long time. I think that’s worth a season of making the post-season and out again in the 1st Round.

The long term future of this club is worth it.

Proctor memories

Apr 22 @ BOS
Proctor enters the game Btm 7, Yankees lead 5-4
Ramirez single to RF
Drew double to LF, Ramirez to 3B
Lowell homers to LF, Ramirez scores, Drew scores
Vizcaino replaces Proctor, Red Sox lead 7-5

May 27 vs LAA
Proctor replaces Mussina in top 7th, 1 out, runner on 1st, Yankees lead 2-1
Kendrick double to LF, Katchman to 3B
Napoli walk, bases loaded
Aybar walk, Kotchman scores, bases loaded
Figgins walk, Kendrick scores, bases loaded
Bruney replaces Proctor, Angels lead 3-2

June 23 @ SFG
Proctor enters Btm 13th, tied 5-5
Klesko single to RF
Molina bunt groundout, P-2B, Klesko to 2B
Feliz fly out, CF
Vizquel single to SS, Klesko to 3rd
Schierholtz single to CF, Klesko scores, Vizquel to 2B,
SF wins 6-5

June 26 @ BAL
Proctor enters Btm 9th, tied 2-2
Patterson walk
Roberts single to LF, Patterson to 2nd
Gomez bunts pop fly to P
Markakis walks
Hernandez walks, Patterson scores, Roberts to 3B, Markakis to 2B
BAL wins 3-2

June 30 vs OAK
Proctor replaces Igawa top 7th, 1 out, 0 on, Oakland leads 4-0
Kendall single to LF
Stewart single to CF, Kendall to 2nd
Ellis fly ball to LF
Swisher double to deep CF, Kendall and Stewart score
Myers replaces Proctor, Oakland leads 6-0

LOL. And some of you guys think this guy was great and it's a huge loss for our bullpen.

I could care less what he does in the inferior National League. He is not a good pitcher. Get over it.

Viper-
If the Yanks could get to October with 3 pitchers on a roll, they could be dangerous as hell. I'd like to see: Wang, Hughes and Pettitte get it going w/ Clemens a not too shabby number 4.

Good post, anon. And those are just a selection of the precious Proctor memories from this season. There's also a theme...which many of you have hit on at various times...and that is, if you don't have location, you won't be effective. Look at those few, those few, those precious few, memories, and note how many walks were part of those meltdowns. If you don't have location or movement, it doesn't matter if you throw Sid Finch speed - ML ballplayers will crush you.

Boss,

Nice move with the "Sid Finch" reference. Didn't he throw like 110 mph? LOL

Absolutely, Jim.

If their pitchers get on a roll -- they will be tough to beat.

I couldn't care less what Boston does because the Yanks have already proved that they can knock their starters around.

Boss,

I'm sorry, I forgot. I'll remember tomorrow to get you the names of those books.

I didn't get the book yet, but before the weekend comes it will be ordered.

Sidd Finch through 168 m.p.h.

Yanks are winning the division!

You bet, Mike! I thought I was dating myself with the Finch comment. Glad you remember! I remember sitting in Mr. McGuire's algebra class at Berner High School reading the SI article...and when I found out it was a fake, I was astonished. Good times!

Yankees are doing what Theo said the Sox would be doing....building from within.
Sox are doing what their fans always accused the Yanks of doing...Signing players past their prime.

Ortiz until last night had 3HR in last 29 games.
Manny has a total of 18HR.
Over the last ten games:
Lugo hitting 195...Drew 189...Varitek 259...Youkilis 263...Lowell at 282 and fading.You would think they need offense not pitching.

But...They trade for Gagne [two shoulder operations and back surgery last 3yrs.]which makes no sense unless you believe the reports out of Boston that Papelbon has lost velocity. He has a ERA 3.48 in the last ten games.Over the same period Beckett is 5-5 with a 3.84 and Dice K is 5-4 but has pitched well. Gagne ERA is 4.35.

Yankees over the same ten game period:Posada 417...Damon 372...Cano 452...Cabrera 351...Abreu 390 with Mo ERA 0.77...Vizcaino 1.00...Villone 2.35...Myers 2.35 even Farnsworth 3.60 is better than Gagne.

The point I'am making is that with Hughes,Chamberlin,Ohlendorf
on the way who needs Gagne.

Boston fans are happier than a namba member in boys
town and I don't know why.Gagne will have little impact.Shilling puts this team over the top and w/o him they don't make it out of the playoffs.

I'm simply amazed by the number of people that really wanted the Yankees to get Gagne giving up Ian Kennedy and another prospect. Chamberlain is currently ranked in the top 10 overall prospects in baseball and Kennedy has been BETTER by a LONG shot at every level.

1.76 ERA, 10+ K/9 0.171 BAA and a 3:1 K/BB ratio

Those are insane numbers for a guy in his first pro season. Hughes is the best the Yanks have, Chamberlain supposedly is #2 and neither one of them ever had numbers that compare to this. The only difference is this kid throws 90-94 instead of 94-96 for Hughes and upto 98 for Chamberlain. If anyone should recognize that the gun isnt everything its Yankee fans who watch Farnsworth's 99 MPH fastballs go 450 feet.

When it comes to the team this year, they can beat anyone hands down. Their lineup which seems to be starting to click can tire out or all out annihalte any pitcher. The other teams in these races don't have strong offenses except the Tigers and their pen is worse than ours. Add to that a rotation which seems to be coming around (allbeit Petitte has been a bit down lately) and look out. Suddenly this team which was given a 5-10% chance of making the playoffs is the favorite to win the wild card.

sorry thats a 4:1 K/BB

Great point about Kennedy Drew...

These young guys very well could decide the direction this team goes the next 5-10 years. Having 3 of the highest prospects in baseball says a lot to Cashman. I think our young players performance these next few months will very well determine the future of Cashman and Torre.

As well as the playoffs.

You have to be in it to win it. All it takes is a team to get hot in the playoffs to win the whole thing. Any team that makes it has a chance.

Drew,

Nobody wants to mortgage the future. But by giving up on a chance to get Gagne - - the same, exact day they got rid of Proctor - - the Yankees tanked their chances for 2007.

Sure, it's great to think the Yanks are positioned well for future seasons. But this isn't a future season, and for the first time in years the organization is flat out giving up. Yeah, last night was fun and all, but don't count on 16 runs a game for the rest of the season.

Think of the Yankees bullpen this way: Imagine if you paid money to watch "The Sopranos" on HBO this year, and halfway through the season they replaced Gandolfini with David Hasselhoff.

It ain't what ya paid for, folks.

Precicely. The Cardinals were supposed to have no prayer last year... yet they beat the easily most dominant team in the NL and they took out the Tigers who had been playing well.

If this team continues to plough along and stays hot through the playoffs... they might just have that spark that has been missing for so long. Not to mention that homegrown feel that was the source of their power in the 90's. Hughes, Chamberlain, Ramirez (ok sortof), Posada, Rivera, Jeter, Petitte, Melkey, Phillips, Cano, Duncan... thats just about 1/2 the Major league roster. Now i can't rememeber all the relief pitchers in the late 90's but i'm leaning towards this team having more home grown players then even those did.

I know I have said it before, but i really wish they would give this kid a shot. Even if he is almost 27, its very uncommon for a guy to consistently hit over 30 homers in the minor leagues.

minor side note: One thing i do hate about Torre is so often he lets kids just sit and then is surprised when they can't perform because they are rusty.

John G... my commitment to wear a Yankee hat is contingent on Mike from Jersey's prediction coming true:

"I believe we will catch Boston by the first week of September. Red Sox will be the wild card. Write that down!"

After last night and seeing how Detroit, Cleveland, Anaheim (NOT L.A.) and Seattle all stayed pat... I am convinced the Yankees will win the Wild Card.

Not saying they'll win it all, but as someone pointed out, every season of the 2000s (except 2001) has included a wild card in the World Series.

And last year's champ (the Cards in case you forgot) wasn't a wild card, but finished the season like a bunch of chumps.

It's when you get hot!

My boys got hot at the right time.

Lest we forget the 2000 Yankees limped into the post season and looked like a potential 3 and out team... then got hot and beat a MUCH stronger on paper A's and Mariners squad and then overmatched the Mets.

Get in the dance, and you have a chance.

As I wrote yesterday, the Yankees have stunned me and I tip my (Red Sox) cap to them that they are back in it.

I said it earlier and no one believed me...

look out for the Twins

How is it possible that trading Proctor is such a big deal? He is so over used that he won't be valuable for this season and probably not next year either.

You really wanted to give up a guy who very likely will be the Yankees #3 starter in 2 years for a 2 month rental of someone with shoulder problems coming off surgery? Or would you prefer to give up their current center fielder and put Damon there?

What are they giving up on? They are 3 games of of the WC and have steadily cut into that lead that was 10 games a month ago

Ed,

Do you really believe that Gange was the answer to the Yankees? That he will make the difference as to if we make the playoffs this year?

You have no idea what your talking about.

And that little analogy with the sopranos makes absolutely no sense.

A. I did not pay for this bullpen

B. We did not replace Mariano Rivera for anyone.

C. Why the hell am i even arguing this.

Ed is a ham sandwich. :)

Ed is a giant pile of vegetable lasanga with extra zucchini

Sully, you are right that the hot team is the one to watch for but despite winning their last 4 games the twins are still barely over 500 since the all-star break

Cashman,

We're not quite as happy as a NAMBLA member at the Boy's Club, but I'm content with the team.

Lugo had a nice stretch and is now sucking up the joint again (thanks for the called 3rd strike with the sacks packed last night) and of course JD Drew has been a vile sea of suck all year.

But, despite the fact that neither Papi nor Ramirez (who has been awesome post break) have been their usual self, I am happy with the pitching staff.

I think Dice-K and Beckett have still pitched well (yesterday's 2nd inning debacle not withstanding... Millar's hit was a seeing eye hit) and Schilling has looked good in his rehab and Lester and Wakefield are what they are.

Plus I do like Papelbon/Okajima/Gagne/DelCarmen in the pen.

Oh yeah, Sox also still have the best record in baseball and the biggest lead.

Now I know Cashman will call all of this "untrue" and "factless" and "shallow rhetoric", but that's why I'm feeling OK.

I'm not a Chicken Little panicking Red Sox fan. There are too many of them and it drives me bonkers.

I think both Red Sox fans and Yankee fans should feel damn good about their teams and who knows, maybe there will be another ALCS match up.

That should light up this board.

If Joba and Hughes can do their job... the playoffs are yours.

If our pitching doesn't fall apart, the playoffs will be ours.

And isn't that what FOX wants?

He smell like hobo's left sox.

He smells like hobo's left sox.

McC:

The Yankees charge high ticket prices and cable TV fees to watch their product. We pay, on the expectation that they'll put a championship-caliber team on the field. By tanking the bullpen - which is exactly what they have done - they're short changing their fans. It's not the product we buy tickets or subscribe to the YES Network to watch.

Farnsworth is awful, we all know that. When Villano is off his game, he's not even Double-A good. Bruney's run is over. It's just a lousy bullpen, period.

Proctor was a horse, and was the only pitcher on the team who would protect Yankee hitters from headhunters. He'll be missed.

Gagne (his name isn't "Gange," by the way) wouldn't have cured everything. But he would have been a bridge to Mariano Rivera. And, considering everything else, that would have been enough.

Ed,

Are you saying Hasselhoff is a bad actor? Because I hear German girls love him!

Hasselhoff is a great singer! lol

Ah but Drew...

They are only 5 games out of a playoff spot

They are only 6 games behind the Tigers for the Division

They have the best pitcher in baseball and a good closer

They have a potent lineup that has disappointed... but could get hot for 9 weeks.

And lest we forget, the Indians have 3 holes in their rotation and the Tigers have been underachieving and have a hole filled bullpen.

I know 6 games (or 5 for the Wild card) is no simple matter... but don't put it past them.

Last year everyone focused on the White Sox and the Tigers... and who won the division. (Granted, the Twins would have traded places with the Tigers and played in the World Series... but that's not the point.)

They are angry about the Castillo trade and talented. Sometimes angry talented teams implode. (See Mets, 1987)

Sometimes angry talented teams WIN A CRAP LOAD (See Mets, 1986)

The Twins have 11 games (!) with the Indians left and 6 left with the Tigers.

Oh... it's possible

I can't believe he's still arguing about not giving up so much for so little.

Ed you really wanted this season didnt you? Getting Gagne wouldn't have guaranteed us the championship this year and would have made the next years to come a lot harder.

Wake up you bologne sandwich.

Hasselhoff actually has better command of the strike zone than Farnsworth.

Exactly, they have 11 games left with the Indians and 6 left with the Tigers... thats a ton of games against good teams (let along the guys outside their division).

I will give you that they are pissed, and that Santana is hands down the best pitcher in baseball, but they are still underachieving and have a hard road. If they can make the playoffs more power to them, but i really think they will have to win their division to do it simply because of how much harder the schedules are for the teams in that division.

Ed,

Where I'll disagree with you is the Yankees have been spending top dollar and NOT putting a championship calliber product on the field.

A month ago I made the Knicks and Rangers analogy and everyone accused me of frequenting male whores, but I stand by that just signing big players because you think "New Yorkers won't stand for anything else" is insane.

Look at who the people on this board are most excited about: Hughes and Joba the Hutt.

They want young YANKEES, not another mercenary.

Now where I'M a touch hypocritical is I do think they made a mistake not upgrading the bullpen. If Joba turns into the K-Rod/Jenks/Wainright of 2007 that's great, but you can't bank on it. Plus how did Atlanta load up on relievers?

But, back to point, despite the fact that a day later I STILL don't understand the Betimet (sp?) trade, how Cashman (the GM not the poster) did can only be judged in a few years.

Last year I KILLED KILLED KILLED Theo for not doing squat at the deadline.

Then it seemed like every Red Sox got injured at the same time... and oh yeah... you guys kicked our ass 5 times in a row in our own ballpark.

September was spent turning Fenway into Pawtucket North.

It turned out him not trading those dudes (and not panicking and shipping Coco off) was the right thing to do.

If the Yankees have the best record in baseball and the biggest lead on August 1, 2008... Cashman should sit back, light a stogie and give out a nice long belch.

Granted, he probably won't be employed by the New York Yankees anymore, but that is beside the fact

Not saying the Twins DON'T have a hard road ahead of them (if I were a betting man... and thank god I'm not... I'd bet on the Tigers getting it done in the central and the Yankees for the Wild Card)

BUT... don't put it past them.
An underachieving team that suddenly gets a spark under their ass?

Could be scary for 2 months\

Anon: I'm a Yankee fan. I want every season to count. The Yankees simply don't have a playoff-caliber bullpen now. And they could have had one.

Hasselhoff was amazing in the musical Jekyl and Hyde.

And by amazing I mean so damn horrible that you couldn't take your eyes away from the game.

Like a Tim Wakefield start when his knuckle ball isn't working

Sully, I completely agree except for your ending shot about his employment. There are already 2 articles out about Hal Steinbrenner's public support of Cash's actions.

The thing that makes both of these teams impressive is that they keep putting contenders out year after year without any rebuilding phase. If the Yanks can get through this year and resign the guys that need it (Rivera/Posada... ideally A-rod, but i wouldn't bet on him, simply because anyone who has Boras as his agent only cares about $$, not the team or players they are with) this team could have one helluva future with quote unquote true yankees.

Yea, and underachieving team with a spark... that sure looks a lot like this team right now. Although i'll give you that the Twins have a shot.

Sully
Wasn't it Theo who said that the way to build a "uber" team is from within....And wasn't it Sully who said the Yanks keep signing players past their prime...

Sully,

I pointed out all of the wildcard entries (other than 2000 which I forgot).

Yeah, I figured that you would make sure that we all understand that the deal to wear the Yankee dome is contigent on what Mike said. LOL

That's the last thing that you need for your Red Sox buddies to see: you wearing Yankee gear!
Your brother will perform an exorcism on your old room at home or something like that. :-)

I call the Angels the "Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim" because I think that it's the dumbest name for a team since another team from Anaheim: The Mighty Ducks! Plus the fact that I loathe the Angels and their fans!

On another note: for anyone that's interested, Michael Kay is going to have Cashman on his radio show at 6pm est (3pm for anyone out west). Should be interesting to hear what he has to say.

But Ed (and I can't believe I am becoming a Yankee defender) but which of the contending Wild Card teams has a loaded pitching staff?

Tigers have Rogers, Zumaya and Rodney all are hurt and they didn't reinforce themselves.

The Indians have Carmona and Sabathia, but after that? Byrd is soso. Lee got sent down. Westbrook is a trainwreck. Borowski is a blown save waiting to happen and save for Betancourt, who can you trust in that pen?

Seattle probably has the best all around bullpen but their rotation is all or nothing.

And if by some miracle Giambi is back (which I don't count much on him) or perhaps Damon continues to hit, the Yankees should beat up tomato cans like the Orioles, Royals, White Sox, D'Rays and a playing out the string Blue Jays team.

Again, not saying I'm picking the Yankees to win the AL Title, but I am saying they are as equipted as anyone to win the Wild Card

Ed

At what expense??? giving up a top young pitcher for 2 months??? It doesn't make sense! Root for your team this year as they struggle... And prepare for a great future.

Yankees will be dominating again in the years to come.

Don't get me wrong. The Yankees have an interesting team because of guys like Melky and Cano and Phillips and Duncan and Hughes.

And I hate it when great prospects are traded for every slow, aging corner outfielder or 5th starter.

But Kennedy-for-Gagne would have upgraded the bullpen dramatically while still leaving Chamberlain, Hughes, T-Clip, Karstens, Henn, etc., in the organization.

Yes Cashman, Theo said the way to build an Uber team was from within.

And while he hasn't stuck with that, I'll take a 7 game lead on August 1.

And yes, I did say that Yankees have a tendency to sign players past their prime.

Not sure how anyone could argue with that.

Or do you call what Brown, Big Unit, Giambi, Damon, Pavano and Wright gave the Yankees their "prime"?

Its ok Sully, anyone who knows baseball... knows baseball regardless of which team they root for. Clearly as with anything else... some know more than others.

Even if not Gagne, why not Dotel or some other ham sandwich not named Farnsworth?

I think Cashman was smart by not mortgaging the farm but he NEEDED to get another arm, not trade one away.

I'd find it hard to imagine that he didn't try to get arms for the pen but couldn't without giving up players that he had said to begin with were untouchable.

If the Yankees pass the Red Sox by Sept 1, I'll post a photo of me wearing a Yankees hat and holding up the day's newspaper (as proof of life) on my blog

http://sullybaseball.blogspot.com/

Ed, do you believe the Yanks are one Eric Gagne away from a serious championship run?

Michaelz:

I believe the bullpen, as it is now, will certainly keep them out of contention. It's the worst bullpen the Yankees have had since Steve Farr/Steve Howe.

Gagne would have kept them in contention.

Okay class; all together now:

BET-E-MIT pronounced: BET-Y-MEET.

Sounds like something the late Andy Kaufman would say in Taxi.

Merely keep them in contention? So then you think it reasonable to surrender arguably the 10th best starter in the minors (who might help the club the next 5-10 years) and your starting centerfielder (no immediate long term replacement avaialable) for a chance to "remain in contention" when 4/5 of our starting rotation will need replaced in the next year or so? And all of this ignores Gagne's health concerns and the fact that he hasn't been pitching well lately. Not seeing it Ed....

Michalez... say no more.

You closed it with that one!

Ed you can still stick Gagne in your fantasy roster. :)

Ed,

What if it cost the Yankees a couple of lower tier prospects?

My boys got him and kept their best pitching and outfield prospects.

What if they said "You can't have Hughes, Cabrera, Chamberlain nor Kennedy, but take 3 others" and you go into the last two months with Rivera/Gagne/Vizcaino/Chamberlain
in the bullpen?

Do you do it?
It's not cut and dry, I grant you. Especially for a team that has to make up ground and isn't in the lead.

But do you do it?

Would someone explain to me how the Tigers and Indians weren't more in the mix for Gagne?

Michaelz:

Well, we can agree to disagree. I'm just not happy with the Yankee organization throwing in the towel like it did yesterday. I believe Yankee fans who pay for tickets and cable subscriptions deserve better.

And let us know how he does. lol

I meant MichaelZ
Sorry

Sully
You state the Yankees have not been putting a championship product on the field....The truth is that the Yanks have nothing but a winning tradition and forced your team to spend money to compete.Who the hell has been finishing in front of the Sox all these years.

Your Knick and Ranger analogy made no sense...The Rangers didn't win the cup because they had young players;they won because they had half the Oilers team on the roster and the Knicks won when they added Earl Monroe.

Last year your team went in the tank long before the injuries and Manny quit on the team. And yes,Boston did panic after finishing 10 games out and signed Lugo and Drew plus overspent on Dice K.

The fact is your team is panicking now with the signing of Gagne.Hell,if they thought he was that good they would of signed him when he was a FA.

Right on Cashman!

Cashman,

Allow me to retort:

1. The Yankees have been putting a playoff caliber team on the field, but if it is the stated goal to win a championship or else, then they haven't been putting a championship product on the field.

That's not rhetoric, that's a fact.

If you are content winning divisions every year, then fine.

2. The Rangers won with lots of veterans and 1994 was, like 2004 for the Red Sox, a "push all the chips in" season. AFTER that, they kept signing big budget names and having the highest payroll in NHL and not making the playoffs. The Knicks were high priced and not winning squat before Isiah showed up...

And both franchises were signing big names without going young because of the nonsensical "New Yorkers need stars" mentality.

I'm not talking about the Earl Monroe days... I'm talking the post-Ewing years.

I agree about the 2006 Sox. They went in the toilet BEFORE the massacre in Fenway, but having Ortiz, Varitek, Papelbon et al go down sure didn't help.

The Sox panicked signing JD (we agree), Lugo was a stop gap (they never should have let Cabrera go) and so far Dice K has worked out.

Again, I don't understand why shoring up your weak spots at the trade deadline is considered a panic move.

But hey... you know best evidently.

Hey Sully
Maybe the Tigers and Indians were put off by the two shoulder operations.

Or could it been the back surgery for the herniated disc.

Or the 4.85ERA over the last ten games.

Or they just wanted the Sox to use their prospects on a broken down two month rental instead of a bat.

Or maybe they saw the cost of the buffet table going sky high.

Fair enough Anon

But the Tigers and Indians have bullpen issues that put the Yankees and Red Sox to shame.

A closer with a 4.85 ERA is a step up for the Indians

Sully, as I said earlier, the Sox position is different. My honest opinion based on what I have seen so far is that the sox are closer to a championship team and thus that one piece really could make a difference. Plus, for reasons not clear to me, the Rangers took far less from you guys than what they were asking for us.

Ed, no one is throwing in the towel. They are bringing back the number one pitching prospect in all of baseball (who nearly threw a no-hitter) and Chamberlain back to bolster their chances for the stretch run. It appears that you and Cash disagree on the best course, but at least his doesn't cost us anything and does NOT mortgage any part of the future...

Fair enough!

Let's play ball already!

Sully
I think both the Yanks and the Sox think they put championship caliber teams on the field. Do you think Boston is content to finish behind the Yankees?
Its called the breaks of the game. In any event,I look forward to them meeting in the playoffs.Last year it just wasn't the same w/o a Boston-Yankee series.

As far as the Knicks are concerned thier championship year was the era of Monroe. Isiah has probably spent more money then any two previous GMs.

And the Rangers,like the Knicks, until the cap always had the highest payroll.Their last championship was in 1994.

After listening to Cashman with Michael Kay today I have a newfound respect for the man whose head I was so viamently calling for just a few hours ago.

You have to respect a guy who knows his job is on the line and rather than do what may be best for himself fell on his sword for the Yankees.

Bravo Cashman.

What can I say I guess I'm a "Flip Flopper" LOL

Cashman, I think you and I are actually agreeing.. at least on the Knicks and Rangers thing.

No, the Sox aren't content on finishing behind the Yankees. In fact one of the fights I would always always ALWAYS get in Red Sox blogs was over the blaming the Yankees for their payroll.

I kept pointing out "in the rest of the country, people lump the Red Sox and the Yankees in the same sentence for gluttony."

I live in the SF Bay Area and when people find out I'm a Red Sox fan (I'm not a subtle man) I get a lot of "You guys are as bad as the Yankees" flak... and I agree with them.

But it beats having a crappy product.

We can't play the lovable loser card. After '04, we all cried thinking of our grandmamas who never saw them win... but now we are a big budget "I'll take your star players for nothing" team.

Truth be told, the 2004 team was one of them as well!

The Yankees and Red Sox are kind of a symbiotic monster... each spending as a reaction to the other.

Why did the Yankees pick up Igawa except to counter the move of Dice-K?

Why did the Sox pick up Gagne except to keep him from the Yankees?

It's fun for us... although the rest of the country laughs when we do that and the ALCS is White Sox/Angels or A's/Tigers.

They laugh, but don't watch as those ALCS got lower ratings than the Yankeeography for Rich Monteleone.

I'd love to see another Yanks/Red Sox ALCS. There are all new characters in this one... plus would be a nice twist to NOT have all the Bucky Dent/Buckner/Boone/Babe clips shoved down our throat.

Phucker,

THANK YOU!!!!!

Welcome to the "Cashman Camp" my friend! :-)

Look at my post on the Damon thread.

That's where I thought all of you guys were.

Cashman is doing the RIGHT THING!!!

Sully, as much as it pains me to admit it, you are a fair unbiased Sock fan with whom I could sit in the bar and share a beer with.

For those that know the history, the Sox were the original Yankees long before the Yankees even existed. It was the Sox that raided other teams rosters and bought the best talent which lead to multiple championships. Most Socks fans get upset, because at least in our lifetime, the Yankees have just done it better. All that is is sour grapes..

I still think the division belongs to you guys, but what's fun about baseball is that nothing is for certain till all the games have been played...

Michael Z, don't have it pain you at all

I lived in NYC from 1990 to 2005... I lived with Yankee fans when the team sucked and when they kept winning WS titles... and through that wonderful fall of 2004.

I lived amongst you, like Sigourney Weaver in Gorillas in the Mist

Pullmanizes Mayfair entailing worthlessness,imagining stiffly?