Simple question: Manny -- Yes or No
Got to be asked. It's now pretty obvious that the Mets blew it by not trading for Manny Ramirez by the July 31 deadline, considering that the Dodgers grabbed him in a three-team deal for virtually nothing. The Red Sox even paid the $8 million left on his contract. Didn't seem to hurt Boston much -- if at all -- but it was everything to the Dodgers.
So now what? Do the Mets, who badly need some righthanded power help, give Man-Ram the four-year, $85-million contract he's reportedly looking for? Or is it more important to spend the money on K-Rod or CC Sabathia? You can't have 'em all.
I'd be wary of Man-Ran. He went into Operation Shutdown in Boston just to prevent the Sox from picking up the one-year, $20-million team option for 2009. Incredibly, he got his wish by getting that option wiped out as part of the trade. Will Ramirez be as motivated after getting his next contract, which is essentially his retirement fund? That's a big if.
Not a bad lineup, though, with Ramirez in the middle of it. Probably won't have to worry about scoring a total of five runs on the final weekend.
I'm really on the fence about Ramirez. The Mets really need a closer, and if they have to pay someone like K-Rod or Brian Fuentes, that doesn't leave a lot of money for Ramirez. But if I was going to sign Manny, it might be a good idea to bring Pedro back with some kind of incentive-laden contract. Pedro is tight with Manny and that would help keep him in check.
Anyway, my colleague Wally Matthews says "No way" on Manny and you can read his take here. Feel free to sound off in the comments section below. I'm enjoying the debate on K-Rod.
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Comments (32)
No, too much of show boat and dogs it.
The money should be used on trades (if we take on salary) and other free agents.
Why does it have to be K-Rod, Fuenes or Ramirez only?
MLB needs a hard cap, which will then put an emphasis on having a good GM and making good trades, which of course we would be screwed right now...
Manny is a great player, but does he have what it takes for New York? I don't think so. When Boston turned against him, Manny shut down. Boston is a tough place to play in terms of the media market. New York is ten times worse. The money can be spent better elsewhere.
Surprising that the early returns are anti-Manny. I expected more in favor, actually.
The Manny you see now is not the Manny you will see in the second year of a Mets contract. The risk is huge that once the bloom of the honeymoon has worn off, the marriage will become a nightmare. The Mets cannot afford the disruption of a nightmare marriage with Manny -- particularly with the Mets lacking someone of the stature and rings of Joe Torre to act as the candid, motivational marriage counselor.
I say "no."
Mike H.
The idea is to get YOUNGER. Definately NO to Manny.
no no no no no no no no no no NO!!!! Priority is middle relief and a closer. Lost too many games after 7 innings. Even a 9 run lead was barely enough to win once.
No way.
Agree with LuAnn. Get YOUNGER.
No way. With obvious talent aside, how could they justify giving someone that much money when he has shown he only cares about himself? No more than a two year deal would be worth it, but we all know there's no way he takes it. I would rather they try to make a trade for Eric Byrnes from AZ if it will not cost them too much, since he is still owed a lot of money.
Everyone says get younger. How? What young hitter is available? The idea of getting younger is a fine philosophy, but I don't see how else the Mets are going to hit their way out of a paper bag next September. Mets need someone big and powerful to get the Wrights and Beltrans more fastballs.
Does everyone remember Wright's infamous strikeout with Murphy on 3rd? Wright had a 3-0 count, and the Cubs still were not afraid to go after him.
I'm not saying Manny is a sure-fire answer, but to disregard the possibility is to disregard one of the Mets biggest needs this off season.
Maybe the Mets can pry Robby Cano from the Yanks. How about a Church/Castillo/Heilman for Cano deal? Yanks could use a left-handed right fielder who is defensively sound and the Mets need a second baseman.
YES to Manny. YES to K-Rod. Do you morons want the Mets in the World Series or not??? You people are obviously brain-dead.
Ceasarrrrrrrrr ............ Where r u pal ? Happen to see the new ACE of the AL Lester last night ? BONIFIED ACE ! Pelfrey cannot be menitioned in the same sentence !
MAnny....Omar the MORON should of got him in 06 or 07 or this past year. No way can you give him Arod money at his age. The guy is the BEST right handed hitter of our generation, but you cannot give him 5 or 6 years...You will have another Pedro on your hands.
Offer him 3 yrs 66 million.....If he takes it, then get him!
Red Sox CRUSHED the Angels....Told yah !
getting manny would make the mets lineup dangerous
imagine this:
reyes ss
beltran cf
wright 3b
ramirez lf
delgado 1b
murphy/hudson 2b
church rf
castro/schneider c
i mean i agree..manny has got issues but he also got talent.
we had 3 guys this year with 100 plus rbis..with manny we can have 4 and hopefully a full year of church and murphy we are a force to be reckoned with...i say if you cant get hudson put murphy at 2nd and either murphy could bat after delgado or flip flop with church.
obviously bullpen needs improvement.
how bout this
sign k-rod
sign joe beimel
sign dareen oliver
new bullpen
(not in any specific order)
beimel
oliver
k-rod
joe smith
parnell
stokes
feliciano/sanchez-one can be kept if necessary
and any 2 of the 3 to rotation-derek lowe, cc sabathia, ben sheets, resign oliver perez
ready for 2009?
Manny is a 'no'...too much chaos. And at 37 you can't be too sure how much gas is left in the tank.
The Rays are young....as are the Redsox....
Ponce de Leon
ummmm, what exactly is 'operation shutdown'. Everyone is portraying him as doing nothing in boston, yet, he was hitting close to .300 with a .900 OPS. I think its a common misconception.
I'd get him and sign him for 3-4 years!
"Operation Shutdown" is refusing to play, then saying days later, it's because of a knee injury. And when asked by Red Sox management which knee it was, Ramirez didn't say -- or didn't know. One of the two. His bluff called, Ramirez returned to the lineup.
Incredibly, his numbers in the 10 games before the trade were quite good:
.351 BA ... .467 OBP ... .622 SLG ... 2 HR ... 8 RBI
And still didn't touch what he did in his first 10 games with LA:
.475 BA ... .543 OBP ... .850 SLG ... 4 HR ... 13 RBI
Change of scenery? Or was Ramirez simply trying again after being liberated from Boston's one-year, $20 million club option?
If the Mets get Manny, he is, with out a doubt, their #3 hitter...not David Wright (who would be 5th). This would also balance their lineup out...reyes-switch, beltran-switch, manny-right, delgado-left, wright-right....for their first 5 hitters
If the Mets get Manny, he is, with out a doubt, their #3 hitter...not David Wright (who would be 5th). This would also balance their lineup out...reyes-switch, beltran-switch, manny-right, delgado-left, wright-right....for their first 5 hitters
I also have a hard time believing that at the end of his career that he will, ON PURPOSE, choose to under perform after signing a contract for 4 years to bring him into his 40's. For being as selfish as everyone says he is, i believe that he would only want to increase his stats as much as the possibly can be increased in the short time that he has left to play professional baseball. He will be definitely shooting for 600 HRs+, 2000 RBI's, and possibly even 3000 hits.
I say a man with lofty goals like that...give him his 4 years/80mil
If Church goes in a package for some people that they need...i'm not really going to be phased. Although he carried the Mets in April, he just had a good start to a bad season. The Mets should allow Daniel Murphy time to play and keep a slot open to eventually insert Fernando Martinez.
justin-while I agree with you on Church, that if he is included in a package then ok, but the type of player they get back should be made up of someone in his mold. Someone who cares, hustles is professional, etc. No doubt he struggled at the end of the season, but everyone struggles at one point in the season, his only time was at the end of the season (grant it he was hurt of a good chuck of it...)
Long way from the UPI days, huh Dave?...as long as they address the bullpen, the regular guy is shut out from CitiField, so how they spend their money is fine by me, as long as money is not the real reason why they did not go after someone. I don't want to see the Mets become the Yankees, but two straight Septembers makes you a bit more jaded as a fan
No to Manny. We can find a lower priced bat for left. We need bullpen HELP and a second baseman.
David, everyone is making him out to be some guy who didn't try after he began sulking in Boston. The stats do not seem to bear that out. He began playing (hitting) much better when all of that turmoil started to occur.
Was he a model citizen? No.
However, to spin it that he 'incredibly' had a 10 game stretch where he played well seems to implicitly state that he lucked into having great stats in spite of the fact that he was in 'operation shutdown'. That argument doesn't seem to hold water to me (then again, perhaps I am a Manny apologist). I don't see how, statistically speaking, someone can point to a .900 OPS (and his stats didn't dip, they were ascending at the time of the trade) and say he was dogging it.
Perhaps he was rejuvenated with the trade to the Dodgers. Sometimes being embarrassed lights a fire under a person. Its not my money, but 3 years and 66 million on the Mets would make them a very relevant NY WS caliber team.
Go Mets in 09!
Why can't you have it all? It's only money. They own the TV and they have a new stadium.
Espo - I believe Church should only go in a package for a quality relief pitcher. Maybe J.J Putz or Huston Street.
Daniel Murphy seemingly came from nowhere and I believe he has the potential to be a real leader and doubles machine. May eventually mature into a high average slugger. He should fill in the right field spot this year and take over Delgado's spot at 1B in 2010 to also make room for Fernando Martinez who, I hope, will be Major League ready by that time. Best case scenario, Manny will occupy LF for the next 4 years. Orlando Hudson for 3-4 years @ 2B.
1-Jose Reyes SS
2-Orlando Hudson 2B
3-Carlos Beltran CF
4-Manny Ramirez LF
5-Carlos Delgado 1B
6-David Wright 3B
7-Bengie Molina C
8-Fernando Martinez RF
9-Johan Santana
Johan Santana SP
A.J Burnett SP
Mike Pelfrey SP
Derek Lowe SP
John Maine SP
Joe Smith RP
Juan Cruz RP
Kyle Farnsworth RP
Pedro Feliciano RP
Brian Stokes RP
Manny Corpas SU
Bob Howry RP
J.J Putz CP
Omar,
What, no Albert Puhjols? You sure you are not a Yankee fan? All-Star at every position. Just keep throwing money, just like the Yanks, who are NOT in the playoffs....
Why is money an issue for the Mets? They have SNY, they're moving into a new cash cow and they are clearing Pedro's contract and potentially Delgado's off the books (remember the adage of getting out a year early rather than a year late).
So there is no reason other than greed on the Wilpons part not to go out and get a big bat (Texeira or Manny), K-Rod or Fuentes and a top-3 starter. You sign those three and some comptetent arms for the pen and there is little reason the team shouldnt be tops in the NL again.
Someone should be pounding the Mets day after day on the FAN about not going all out for Vlad Guerrero if there is a hint that they are going cheap this year.
Just because you have the money doesn't mean that you have to just throw it around at all stars at every position. It has not worked for the Yankees and they have been doing it for quite some time. Teams improve by developing young talent, signing a few "role players" as free agents, and finding power arms for the bullpen. With that being said, the Mets have not really done a good job drafting in the recent years. The "power bat" that they drafted this year as their future first baseman hit a grand total of 0 home runs and had 15 extra base hits in 215 at bats in rookie ball. That is not good. The team needs to entirely revamp it's scouting system.
SS - Reyes
3B - Wright
1B - Texeira
CF - Beltran
LF - Burrell or Murphy
RF - Church
2B - Hudson
C - Castro/Sch.
SP - Johan (L)
SP - C.C. (L)
SP - Lowe
SP - Pelfrey
SP - Maine
RP - Howry
RP - Beimel
RP - Ohman (L)
RP - Hawkins
RP - Feliciano (L)
RP - Parnell
SU - Smith
CL - K-Rod
Yes. I want to revamp the entire pen, no matter the cost. First and foremost the pen must be changed. The Mets can't lose leads anymore. You gotta crack some eggs to make an omelet, the only thing is an omelet can't fill a brand new stadium and make your money back. You gotta spend some money to make money but it's gotta be done right. This squad I built is young and can grow next season and several season to come together. There's veteran leadership mixed in there and quite a bit of experience. The RP can help the younger relievers like Parnell and Smith and they can learn more from them. The lineup is young but mature and experienced, not to mention this could be the best defensive infield the Mets have had in years, yes that's a shot at the right side of the infield. I want Wright running more. He's a 30/30 guy you just gotta let me loose. He's a patient hitter and being in the two spot that allows Reyes to move more and him to sit on more fast balls when Reyes is on base. Not to mention being in the two spot takes some pressure of the three spot off him. The downside to my 3,4 spots are Beltran and Tex have 29/25 HRs vs. LHP but 72/71 HRs vs. RHP over the past three years, but on the bright side they have batting avgs. of .293 and .316 vs. LHP. If you spend money make it an investment on a player you can get reward from for years to come (go younger) not a player that produced well in the past and steadily declines the rest of their contract. I still think we need to give younger talent more shots like we were forced to. I like seeing players that give 110% every play and has something to prove than a player who lives off who they used to be and shows flashes of greatness from time to time.
Absolutly not. This guy is a cancer in the dugout, and getting old to boot.
So Basley, you have the Mets signing Texeira,Burrell,Krod, Sabathia, Hudson, and trading for the other 3 bullpen guys...Maybe then we can trade Ayala, Heilmann and Castillo for Prince Fielder to backup and be ready when Delgado leaves...Amazing..Oh and you are talking about Latroy Hawkins, Delgado hit a grand slam off him that has yet to land, and ask your Yankee friends how good he is......
Everyone I have on there is a free agent, last I checked unless I was looking at the wrong list. I'm sure Latroy Hawkins will give up more home runs in his career, pitchers tend to do that from time to time. I'm just saying from what I've seen I would rather have him trot out of the pen than anything we have right now. I'm sure the Wilpons wouldn't mind opening up the wallet for these players. They're young and talented enough they can still get better and produce for a long time to come. And I don't really want K-Rod I feel he's the "number 1 stunner" in some Mets front office personnels' minds. I know this is a video game type team but can you give me a reason you wouldn't want any of the players I've put on there? I know it's Yankee esq in spending but these aren't Giambi, Abreu, etc. type talent that is past their prime. The price tag on these players is for what they can do in the future not necessarily what they have done, feel me?
Go Get Manny. The bullpen blew what like 40 games last year, now put Manny's RBI's in the mix and they won't have the option to blow that many games. Parnell looked great, they got this kid in the minors who looked bad last year in a few games but in my opinion the future closer Kunz. They are not that bad with the arms than people say, can't count on delgado to be the power bat all year and you know what you will get out of Manny, keep him happy, pay him the money.