Community Watchdog

Based on a reader question about the fire siren in Center Moriches, we asked whether you think firehouse sirens are still needed in the digital age.

There are no winning or losing answers, but from the close to 200 responses, there obviously are strong feelings on both sides of the issue.

This wasn’t supposed to be a debate about whether a paid system should replace volunteers, but that’s where some readers took the discussion. You can read all the comments on two Newsday.com Web pages: here on this blog, and here, where the story was posted after it ran in the Jan. 20 issue of Newsday..

Also, here are more unedited comments, sent to watchdog@newsday.com. Some writers chose to post anonymously.

With regard to the question posed in Newsday's January 20, 2008, Community Watchdog column I submit that the intensity of the alarm is a danger to anyone outdoors within several hundred feet of the siren. If the chairman, John Zlatniski, has been able to modify the times of operation of the sirens and limit them to fires only at night and has been able to function safely for the past four years then it seems the siren is an outmoded means of alerting responders.
--Frank Cibelli, Amityville, NY

I can’t speak for the rest of Long Island, but when I inquired of our local fire company, I was told sirens are “required by the insurance rating board”. When I asked to see proof of this requirement, I was told they would “get back to me”. That was almost 2 years ago, so I’m beginning to doubt the truth behind that particular answer.
This is the same fire company who, after they erected a 48’ tall auxiliary house in a residential, claimed:
1. They sent notification letters all of the 40 some odd homes directly affected, but they all seemed to have been lost in the certified mail.
2. They purposely withheld information about their plans, so as not to cause resistance.
They have just installed a new siren, higher on the house by some 8 – 10 feet, (total height now over 50 in a residentially zoned neighborhood).
Maybe they are trying to compensate?
--UNSIGNED

YES, alarms ARE still necessary.
How many times can volunteers be sitting around awaiting an alarm- they have personal lives- they may be in a location not to hear- etc. Many things can happen, and in the meantime, if this alarm were not to ring- YOU can be in needy person--
I get so disgusted when people complain - my son was -till he moved out of Nassau- volunteer fireman and EMT. How many times did that alarm go off in his room- and the whole house was awakened, but we knew it was a neighbor,friend,etc in need of help-
Rather than complain- why not get out and help
Do you have any idea what it would cost you in taxes if a PAID fire dept were to be - this will happen, as not enough willing hands—
--UNSIGNED

sidewalks popping up sirens at night gee to bad i have lived out in suffolk county since 1939. all the new comers want is a fantasy land. Sidewalks years ago always popped up because of the trees that lined them.So lets see cut down all the trees rip up the sidewalks and we will all be better off. Sirens at night ???
Same thing . lived with that -raised kids-am a volly. Raised my kids not coddled them. They could sleep in a
noisy enviroment and my grandchildren are doing fine also. Get with it and love the country you live in. Too
noisy move to Greenland
-- UNSIGNED

We asked for comments on this blog and in the newspaper's Sunday column whether readers thought firehouse sirens are still necessary in the digital age. Below are responses sent to watchdog@newsday.com. Nameless comments were sent that way. More than 150 additional comments were submitted after it was posted on newsday.com. Click here to see them. Also, more readers wrote opinions in the "Comments" link at the end of the story on the Community Watchdog blog below.

There are strong arguments on both sides. Feel free to add to the discussion. Thanks to all who took the time to send some thoughtful views and opinions.

People must remeber that we on Long Island are served by a VOLUNTEER FIRE DEPARTMENT. NO ONE is sitting up at the fire house all the time waiting for your house to go on fire. Pagers and Cells don't always work as most of us already know. Most Fire Departments do not use them at night unless it's a big fire or they need more personnel to respond. So people who complaint about an occassional fire siren going off at night should say a pray and thank the good lord they weren't sounded for them or their loved ones. -- Bill Torio

I read with great interest your column on the need for fire sirens in todays modern age. I am a member of my district's Board of Fire Commissioners and believe that the sirens and/or horns still play an important role in alerting the firefighters and community of an emergency. Over the years we too have made compromises as to the time and length of the activations. From 6AM to 6PM we sound the siren for all alarms, from 6PM to 6AM we sound the siren only for structure fires, mutual aid calls, "unknown type" of fire calls, and for second alarms.(more help needed from our own department) The siren sounds daily at noon, which I have found that the community relies on the "noon whistle". As I mentioned before, the siren warns the community that an emergency is in progress and to watch out for volunteers responding to the firehouse and firetrucks that will be responding shortly thereafter. Another point to bring out is the fact if you happen to be the one calling in an emergency, it is very reassuring to hear the siren sound and know that your call for help is being answered by volunteers in your community and they will be on their way to help you. We also have pagers and text messaging to our members that have cell phones and wanted to partricipate. Both systems are not 100% reliable. Using all three methods gives us assurance that a response will be forthcoming. Also we have a backup generator at the firehouse that automatically operates in the event of a power outage and has full capability to power the firehouse and the siren. There could be times that it may be our only way to notfy our members. In this day and time it may be necessary to use the siren to notify the public of other emergencies. This would be similar to the Civil Defense system that was in place during the "cold war" years in the 50's & 60's. People need to know that when they move next to or close by a fire station or satellite siren that there are going to be times of activity when the sirens are going to sound or you are going to hear emergency vehicles leave the station. Hopefully those folks will get used to it and understand. Rich T. Bellport, NY

I suppose the person who lives next to the Fire House, hasn't lived there their whole life. I bet it's the whole " I just moved here and now I want to change everything " policy adopted by ignorant fools. First they will get rid of the fire whistle then next will be the sirens on the fire trucks, then it will be the pagers (that get us to the fire house and to the scene) that make that awfully loud noise. This must be the same type of person who complains that the Fire Department does not respond quick enough to their emergency.
Gee,, if I only had a fire whistle or better technolgy to alert me of a rescue maybe I could have responded to the Fire House, so the Ambulance could have made it to you quicker sir.
The worst part of all of this is that these ignorant people are trying to abolish the traditions and usefull tools that help the Fire Personnel; help these ignorant people.
-- Jeff

On an island of all volunteer fire departments, sirens serve to notify emergency responders that they are needed and notify the general public that emergency responders may be passing by and caution and right of way should be afforded these valiant servants of the community.

Joseph Cicio
(formerly of North Lindenhurst)

GIVE US VOLUNTEERS A BREAK.

IF YOU NEEDED EMERGENCY HELP AND AN EMT DIDNT HEAR HIS PAGER BUT DID HEAR THE SIREN YOU WOULD BE GLAD TO SEE HIM.
YOU WOULDNT WANT TO PAY US VOLUNTEERS FOR WHAT WE FO ON OUR TIME FOR YOU THE GENERAL PUBLIC. (UNSIGNED)

Nick Tsoupas of Center Moriches and his family, including his 3-year-old daughter who is startled by fire sirens at night.

Newsday Photo by Daniel Goodrich

The firehouse siren in Center Moriches is a big problem. It interrupts my sleep and my peace. I would like to investigate this siren practice because my 2-year-old daughter is always startled. Each responder has a pager.

--Nick Tsoupas, Center Moriches

Things aren't likely to change soon. The fire department already limits the use of its siren at night, according to John Zlatniski, chairman of the district's Board of Fire Commissioners.

Between 10 p.m. and 6 a.m., it sounds only for fires, an average of about once every two weeks. Before the policy was adopted four or five years ago, the firehouse sounded the siren for the 1,000 ambulance calls it receives annually, Zlatniski said. "We used to blow the siren at night for everything," he said.

Since the advent of pagers and even newer technologies, more residents have asked about the necessity for firehouse sirens said Suffolk County's Fire, Rescue and Emergency Services Commissioner Joe Williams.

A handful of the county's 109 fire districts have stopped the sirens at night, a move that's determined by each district's Board of Fire Commissioners.

Williams said he does not encourage that practice. "Sirens are the most reliable method of alerting responders to an emergency," he said. "Cell phones don't always work...Neither do radios...The sirens are a great back-up method."

When an emergency is called in, Suffolk's Fire Control Bureau in Yaphank sends text messages and pages to responders and sounds the local siren. There are no local or state regulations regarding its loudness or duration. Williams said, "The only requirement is that all sirens be programmed to ring at noon as a test measure."

WATCHDOG WEIGH-IN:

Are sirens needed in the digital age? Comment here or e-mail watchdog@newsday.com. Results will be posted on this blog, newsday.com/watchdog.